I am not a fan of Veach's "tier" approach.

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

1. That's fair.

2. This is fine, and I do understand that some players are of higher value to certain teams that run certain schemes. But let me break this down for you: Nick Bolton is probably not going to be playing passing downs. And if he does, that's not what he was good at for the Tigers. So... you've drafted a two-down linebacker in the Hitchens mold 58th overall, with good passrushers and receivers on the board. That's just not a wise use of resources.

3. I absolutely don't think we should have reached for anyone, ever. Nor am I saying we should pass up on an "A" linebacker for a "C" wide receiver simply because we have a dire need there and WR is more valuable. I'm saying that I had four players on my board -- Dyami Brown, Terrace Marshall, Ronnie Perkins, and Carlos Basham -- who were all valuable at the low 2nd picks, who all played valuable positions that we had desperate needs at, and we punted for a linebacker (which we did need!) who can't play the pass particularly well.

4. All good points, I don't disagree.

But I would have taken Ronnie Perkins and entered the 2021 season with two starting-caliber defensive ends and a competent Blythe at center than further-packing our OL and leaving one DE position wide open, which we've done.

Re: #2

Here's the thing (and despite being a Mizzou fan, I wasn't over the moon with the pick), though: You're projecting Bolton as a 2-down LB. He has great instincts and was an effective pass defender in short areas at Mizzou. He's not a nothing at pass defense. He isn't auto death if he gets matched up in the flat.

He doesn't have the size and speed to play man-up defense against a Darren Waller or really elite, athletic move TE... at least not deep down the field... and would be a bad fit at MLB in a cover 3 D. But the guy isn't a zero at pass pro by any means.

Re: #3
Terrace Marshall and Dyami Brown were higher on my want list than Bolton, too. I think there are real questions about Perkins' fit in this defense (is he big enough? does he defend the run well enough?), though. And Bashem - as a guy who would need to reduce inside to rush the passer - wasn't of the same value as a Peyton Turner would have provided. I don't think there was a DE that fits the scheme that was a great value at that pick.

All indications are we're going to see a lot of Chris Jones at DE on base downs. That reduces some DE need both in 21 and 22. I understand the concern moving forward and the idea that they're going to have to address the position. But I don't really believe Bashem or Perkins drastically changes that equation.

I think you're paranoid, though, if you're looking at this team and seeing holes all over the place.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

Re: #2

Here's the thing (and despite being a Mizzou fan, I wasn't over the moon with the pick), though: You're projecting Bolton as a 2-down LB. He has great instincts and was an effective pass defender in short areas at Mizzou. He's not a nothing at pass defense. He isn't auto death if he gets matched up in the flat.

He doesn't have the size and speed to play man-up defense against a Darren Waller or really elite, athletic move TE... at least not deep down the field... and would be a bad fit at MLB in a cover 3 D. But the guy isn't a zero at pass pro by any means.

Re: #3
Terrace Marshall and Dyami Brown were higher on my want list than Bolton, too. I think there are real questions about Perkins' fit in this defense (is he big enough? does he defend the run well enough?), though. And Bashem - as a guy who would need to reduce inside to rush the passer - wasn't of the same value as a Peyton Turner would have provided. I don't think there was a DE that fits the scheme that was a great value at that pick.

All indications are we're going to see a lot of Chris Jones at DE on base downs. That reduces some DE need both in 21 and 22. I understand the concern moving forward and the idea that they're going to have to address the position. But I don't really believe Bashem or Perkins drastically changes that equation.

I think you're paranoid, though, if you're looking at this team and seeing holes all over the place.

2. Fair. I guess we'll see.

3. Also fair, but check my previous post on playing Jones at DE. I'm not a fan.

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

2. Fair. I guess we'll see.

3. Also fair, but check my previous post on playing Jones at DE. I'm not a fan.

It's all situational. If the Chiefs have a two-score lead, I wouldn't expect to see Jones at DE.

It's also about what vet they can add in FA. If they can add Justin Houston or Kerrigan, for example, they can probably roll with that guy as their main man at LE. Melvin Ingram might lead to more of a role for Jones at E on non-passing downs.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

1. That's fair.

2. This is fine, and I do understand that some players are of higher value to certain teams that run certain schemes. But let me break this down for you: Nick Bolton is probably not going to be playing passing downs. And if he does, that's not what he was good at for the Tigers. So... you've drafted a two-down linebacker in the Hitchens mold 58th overall, with good passrushers and receivers on the board. That's just not a wise use of resources.

3. I absolutely don't think we should have reached for anyone, ever. Nor am I saying we should pass up on an "A" linebacker for a "C" wide receiver simply because we have a dire need there and WR is more valuable. I'm saying that I had four players on my board -- Dyami Brown, Terrace Marshall, Ronnie Perkins, and Carlos Basham -- who were all valuable at the low 2nd picks, who all played valuable positions that we had desperate needs at, and we punted for a linebacker (which we did need!) who can't play the pass particularly well.

4. All good points, I don't disagree.

But I would have taken Ronnie Perkins and entered the 2021 season with two starting-caliber defensive ends and a competent Blythe at center than further-packing our OL and leaving one DE position wide open, which we've done.

I disagree strongly that Bolton is a two down LB. Very strongly.

I disagree strongly that Ronnie Perkins is a 3 down 4-3 end. Hes's 6'2", 253 lbs with 32" arms. No length, no meat, no 3 down 4-3 DE. He's a situational pass rusher for a team like KC or he gets eaten alive in the running game.

I liked Dyami, Amon-Ra, Amari Cooper, several WR's in that range. KC front office apparently didn't as much as we did. That doesn't mean we're wrong, and in fact only time will tell if they're right. I suppose what irritates me is that your posts come off as if you are declaring them "wrong" and you "right". Which is plain silly. You want to criticize, you need to wait and see what plays out, otherwise you're just a guy on the internet bitching that they didn't like the guys you liked.