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03-29-2023, 08:39 AM
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Has a particular set of skills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: On the water
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***Official 2023 STL Cardinals Thread ***
2023 thread. Walker makes the roster. I'll update the rosters and opening day lineup when its official
2023 Opening Day Lineup
Spoiler!
2022 Opening Day roster.
Spoiler!
For the new Cardinal fans that joined the Planet since last year, here are some of the historical threads going back to 2006.
Spoiler!
Last edited by BigRedChief; 03-30-2023 at 10:48 AM.. |
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Posts: 79,088
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11-27-2023, 08:13 AM
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#1501 |
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MVP
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
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For whatever it’s worth John Heyman is reporting the cards are expected to finalize a deal with Sonny Gray today. I haven’t seen anything on numbers yet but this offseason is feeling pretty on brand so far.
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Posts: 14,521
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11-27-2023, 08:15 AM
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#1502 | |
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What's up braj?
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Placencia, Belize
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Quote:
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Posts: 15,584
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11-27-2023, 08:17 AM
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#1503 | |
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Has a particular set of skills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: On the water
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Quote:
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Posts: 79,088
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11-27-2023, 08:49 AM
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#1504 |
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The Insider
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Lake of the Ozarks
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3 for 75 for Gray. 25 million per season
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Posts: 49,670
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11-27-2023, 08:51 AM
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#1505 | |
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What's up braj?
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Placencia, Belize
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Quote:
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Posts: 15,584
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11-27-2023, 08:59 AM
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: 41°59.4′N 87°39.6'W
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Why am I even pleasantly surprised that it’s only three years when I expected Mo to give even more. Ugh. |
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Posts: 2,507
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11-27-2023, 09:00 AM
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#1507 |
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Sauntering Vaguely Downwards
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbia, Mo
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Eh, they kept it to 3 years at least. He should be a solid pitcher for about 425 innings over those three seasons and has a little genuine upside to be a fringe 1 or strong 2 for 500+ over that stretch.
Their youngest SP is 33 (Matz). Eh, it could've been worse. But we'll see what Yamamoto goes for. If the AAV is close and the term is 6-8 years, that was the way to go. Then again, it's possible they just couldn't get him to come to the Midwest. We'll see. |
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Posts: 60,566
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11-27-2023, 09:03 AM
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#1508 |
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In Search of a Life
Join Date: Nov 2010
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3 years isn't even that bad. I was thinking someone was going to give him 4-5. He was a 95 percentile pitcher. If he can stay healthy, probably a good chance the Cardinals come out ahead on the deal. I guess the main issue is that they've committed themselves to a retirement age rotation.
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Posts: 24,325
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11-27-2023, 09:15 AM
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#1509 |
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The Insider
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Lake of the Ozarks
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I'm shocked they went free agent route. I figured they would trade for Glasnow.
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Posts: 49,670
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11-27-2023, 09:18 AM
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#1510 |
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Red state
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The Cardinals will lose their second-highest pick in the 2024 draft and $500K of international bonus pool space due to the signing of a free agent that received a qualifying offer.
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11-27-2023, 09:37 AM
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Sauntering Vaguely Downwards
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbia, Mo
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That should probably net them about 9 WAR. I think to truly come out 'ahead' on the deal I'd want to see them get nearer to 11/12 WAR over that term but I don't think that's terribly likely. He'd likely need to get to 90 starts for that and I'm not seeing it. Ultimately I think it's just a pretty high floor deal in that Gray gets hurt quite a bit but rarely catastrophically. It's just some 3-5 week absence that costs him 6-8 starts and otherwise he's gonna go throw 6+ innings/start and be 25-30% above average in those starts. Not much ceiling there; certainly not as much as Yamamoto and likely not someone that's going to anchor a meaningful post-season run. I mean ultimately the stuff's just not there for that; he's a crafty righty who leans into his breaking stuff. As an undersized righty there are some breakdown concerns there but they're lessened by the fact that he's not really a max-effort, fireballer type. |
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Posts: 60,566
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11-27-2023, 10:19 AM
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#1512 |
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Now you've pissed me off!
Join Date: Jan 2006
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That's a great singing if you need more pitching depth to get over the top and he can slot in as a #2. As your #1 coming off of a career year at 34, that's classic Mo. He's basically 3-3.5 WAR per year over the last six seasons.
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11-27-2023, 10:24 AM
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#1513 |
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Greatest QB Duo of 2015
Join Date: Mar 2010
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I like the three signings individually, but not collectively. Gibson and Gray are good together. They need to either bring someone else that slots at possibly a 1 or 2 (unlikely) or additional depth that can eat innings as needed (competition with Lynn).
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Posts: 17,088
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11-27-2023, 10:38 AM
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#1514 |
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The Insider
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Lake of the Ozarks
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There is extreme value in having starting pitchers that can go 6 innings every 5 days.
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Posts: 49,670
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11-27-2023, 10:45 AM
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Sauntering Vaguely Downwards
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Columbia, Mo
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But you look at what the Phil's inked Nola for, they essentially got Nola for ages 31-37 at less than $25 million/season and we gave $25 million/season for 35-37 for Gray. So we effectively bought the last 3 seasons of the Nola deal without the remaining pitcher prime seasons at the front end of it at a higher AAV. Then again, I don't think Nola's aging particularly well. Its possible that the next 3 years for Nola and the next 3 years for Gray are very similar with the back half of the Nola deal being a real problem. At least Gray's adjusted to his aging nicely and seems to be working with the age-related decline really nicely. Not everyone proves they can do that, so signing someone that has can really work out nicely. Especially when you're not as worried about innings limits at that point. |
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Posts: 60,566
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***Official 2023 STL Cardinals Thread ***
Linear Mode
