Falcon and The Winter Soldier trailer

[Tribal Warfare]

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by Clyde Frog

Is this worth the watch or should I just watch the “New Rockstars” breakdowns to get caught up? Wanted to wait until all the episodes dropped but I’m still finding it difficult to get hyped for multiple hours of The Sam and Bucky Show.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

With lowered expectations, yes. Don't expect a re-watch down the line. Couple of fight scenes are epic, others are meh. The bad nemesis is for shit.

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

I watched the second episode of “Avengers Assembled” which featured the making of TFATWS. Even though it gives away much of the story line and spoilers, it also offers perspective on the series from the producers, writers and directors, which frames the show as more of a “soul searching” drama than typical MCU fare.

I think my reaction to the series would have been different had I realized the intent of the series because I was expecting a continuation of typical MCU fare and not an introspective look at Sam and Bucky’s motivations.

That $150 million dollar price tag really skewed my expectations.

Was it a show runner issue? Who's getting the blame for the at best, underwhelming reaction, to the season? Is there a D&D to blame here?

[Deberg_1990]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Was it a show runner issue? Who's getting the blame for the at best, underwhelming reaction, to the season? Is there a D&D to blame here?

Some of it was the issue of having to cut the original storyline about a virus. They Didn’t want to come off as insensitive after covid hit.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990

Some of it was the issue of having to cut the original storyline about a virus. They Didn’t want to come off as insensitive after covid hit.

That rumor is false.

Marcus Spellman, the head writer of the series, was more interested in showing how difficult the Black experience in America would be for a Black man to assume the mantle of Captain America and as such, hired a writer's room with black writers only.

The series was a character study. The producers were more concerned about the dramatic details over typical MCU action fare, which is what we got.

If anyone "failed", it's the Marketing Department because the trailers and promos made the series look as if it would be a normal MCU entry but it was far from it.

[lawrenceRaider]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

That rumor is false.

Marcus Spellman, the head writer of the series, was more interested in showing how difficult the Black experience in America would be for a Black man to assume the mantle of Captain America and as such, hired a writer's room with black writers only.

The series was a character study. The producers were more concerned about the dramatic details over typical MCU action fare, which is what we got.

If anyone "failed", it's the Marketing Department because the trailers and promos made the series look as if it would be a normal MCU entry but it was far from it.

The failure is in targeting an audience that doesn't exist for this type of Marvel fare. There simply isn't a large audience who wants what you describe from any series like this.

[KC_Connection]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

The series was a character study.

That's fine, but they also pretty much failed in this regard as well.

You don't have to look any further than Watchmen a few years ago for a far better character study involving superheros that touches on the Black experience in America.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by lawrenceRaider

The failure is in targeting an audience that doesn't exist for this type of Marvel fare. There simply isn't a large audience who wants what you describe from any series like this.

Originally Posted by KC_Connection

That's fine, but they also pretty much failed in this regard as well.

You don't have to look any further than Watchmen a few years ago for a far better character study involving superheros that touches on the black experience in America.

I do not disagree.

It's difficult to believe that Marvel gave the same exact team carte blanche for Captain America 4.

I think they've misinterpreted steaming numbers for actual interest in the series.

[Bowser]

That's a great comparison with Watchmen and TFatWS, actually. Both could have been amazing stories, but both got drug down into the SJW mud by the people setting the story up.

The ironic thing is that in the Phase 4 hype video, it starts off with Stan Lee saying how these stories are escapism, and how everyone is each other's brother and sister. Two very distinctly different messages being put out by Marvel to be sure.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by Bowser

That's a great comparison with Watchmen and TFatWS, actually. Both could have been amazing stories, but both got drug down into the SJW mud by the people setting the story up.

The ironic thing is that in the Phase 4 hype video, it starts off with Stan Lee saying how these stories are escapism, and how everyone is each other's brother and sister. Two very distinctly different messages being put out by Marvel to be sure.

This isn't a political statement by me, just an observation:

Marvel has apparently decided that it's best for certain ethnicities to run and write for specific characters. Notice how Black Panther had an all Black cast and crew (save for Ludwig Goransson, the composer). Anthony Mackie stated he thought that was more "racist" than just hiring the best people. Same thing happened with The Falcon & The Winter Soldier series in which the showrunner, producer and writer was Black, as was the entire writer's room.

Shang-Ti has an Asian cast and an Asian director. The Eternals has an Asian director and several Asian characters, along with an Asian lead in Gemma Chan (who is absolutely Hot AF!).

It's clear that Chloé Zhao is a very talented director because she dominated awards season and supposedly, Marvel is absolutely blown away by what she did with The Eternals. But Marcus Spellman (TFATWS & Cap 4) and Daniel Creston (Shang Ti) had zero experience directing $200 million dollar plus properties and from the outside, it looks as if they catered to the SJW mob who has been demanding that Asians can only direct Asians, Blacks can only direct Blacks while females can only direct females. We're seeing it with the upcoming TV series as well.

My post isn't meant to demean any of those people because if anyone knows how difficult it is to even get a movie made in this town, it's me. I just see it as somewhat of a concerning trend, especially since the Oscars, because they've now been calling for more female composers to score films. I tend to think that if there was the female equivalent of John Williams, Hans Zimmer, Alan Silvestri, Brian Tyler, Christophe Beck, et al, they'd have so much work that they'd need to pass it on to other composers.

Anyway, I just don't understand how Marvel can live up to the expectations set in Phase 1, 2 & 3 if they're not hiring the best people in the business to write, direct and produce their films and instead, are cowering to the "mob".

[Buehler445]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

This isn't a political statement by me, just an observation:

Marvel has apparently decided that it's best for certain ethnicities to run and write for specific characters. Notice how Black Panther had an all Black cast and crew (save for Ludwig Goransson, the composer). Anthony Mackie stated he thought that was more "racist" than just hiring the best people. Same thing happened with The Falcon & The Winter Soldier series in which the showrunner, producer and writer was Black, as was the entire writer's room.

Shang-Ti has an Asian cast and an Asian director. The Eternals has an Asian director and several Asian characters, along with an Asian lead in Gemma Chan (who is absolutely Hot AF!).

It's clear that Chloé Zhao is a very talented director because she dominated awards season and supposedly, Marvel is absolutely blown away by what she did with The Eternals. But Marcus Spellman (TFATWS & Cap 4) and Daniel Creston (Shang Ti) had zero experience directing $200 million dollar plus properties and from the outside, it looks as if they catered to the SJW mob who has been demanding that Asians can only direct Asians, Blacks can only direct Blacks while females can only direct females. We're seeing it with the upcoming TV series as well.

My post isn't meant to demean any of those people because if anyone knows how difficult it is to even get a movie made in this town, it's me. I just see it as somewhat of a concerning trend, especially since the Oscars, because they've now been calling for more female composers to score films. I tend to think that if there was the female equivalent of John Williams, Hans Zimmer, Alan Silvestri, Brian Tyler, Christophe Beck, et al, they'd have so much work that they'd need to pass it on to other composers.

Anyway, I just don't understand how Marvel can live up to the expectations set in Phase 1, 2 & 3 if they're not hiring the best people in the business to write, direct and produce their films and instead, are cowering to the "mob".

Agreed. I don’t know much about the industry so I can’t really comment. But the bolded is succinctly the way I feel.

This is business. We’re in it to win it. At least I am in mine.

As far as cowering yo the mob, this sounds more like dumbass HR policy than worrying about Twitter. But I could be all the way wrong on that one.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Agreed. I don’t know much about the industry so I can’t really comment. But the bolded is succinctly the way I feel.

This is business. We’re in it to win it. At least I am in mine.

As far as cowering yo the mob, this sounds more like dumbass HR policy than worrying about Twitter. But I could be all the way wrong on that one.

I don't think it's HR but I can't say for sure. Here's a segment of an upcoming Rolling Stone interview with Kevin Feige about Dr. Strange & WandaVision:

-------------

In an upcoming interview with Kevin Feige at Rolling Stone, Benedict Cumberbatch’s Doctor Strange was indeed set to appear. But then, something changed.

Feige says that the fictional commercials for products like “Toast Mate” and “Hydra Soak” during WandaVision were actually intended to build up to a Doctor Strange appearance. The ads were originally intended to be messages sent to Wanda from Doctor Strange, as he also attempted to break through her fake reality. Marvel had actually finalized a deal with Cumberbatch to appear in the finale until a late-stage rewrite saw him written out. Feige says:

“Some people might say, ‘Oh, it would’ve been so cool to see Doctor Strange. But it would have taken away from Wanda. We didn’t want the end of the show to be commoditized to go to the next movie – here’s the white guy, ‘Let me show you how power works.'”

---------
I kept wondering where the Dr. Strange 2 tie-in would occur but apparently, it was re-written at the last minute.

Considering they'd been hyping WandaVision as important to Phase 4 and specifically, Dr. Strange 2, it seems really odd that they'd ax it at the last minute, unless there was pressure coming from somewhere.

[Buehler445]

What a strange (no pun intended LOL) thing to say about one of your star characters.

[Baby Lee]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

I don't think it's HR but I can't say for sure. Here's a segment of an upcoming Rolling Stone interview with Kevin Feige about Dr. Strange & WandaVision:

-------------

In an upcoming interview with Kevin Feige at Rolling Stone, Benedict Cumberbatch’s Doctor Strange was indeed set to appear. But then, something changed.

Feige says that the fictional commercials for products like “Toast Mate” and “Hydra Soak” during WandaVision were actually intended to build up to a Doctor Strange appearance. The ads were originally intended to be messages sent to Wanda from Doctor Strange, as he also attempted to break through her fake reality. Marvel had actually finalized a deal with Cumberbatch to appear in the finale until a late-stage rewrite saw him written out. Feige says:

“Some people might say, ‘Oh, it would’ve been so cool to see Doctor Strange. But it would have taken away from Wanda. We didn’t want the end of the show to be commoditized to go to the next movie – here’s the white guy, ‘Let me show you how power works.'”

---------
I kept wondering where the Dr. Strange 2 tie-in would occur but apparently, it was re-written at the last minute.

Considering they'd been hyping WandaVision as important to Phase 4 and specifically, Dr. Strange 2, it seems really odd that they'd ax it at the last minute, unless there was pressure coming from somewhere.

****ing reerun.

[Buehler445]

Nonetheless that’s a troubling trend.

There is a substantial difference in the way in which Black Panther addressed race (positively, secondary to the story), and F/WS did (negatively, lecturing).

Frankly I don’t need any more of the latter in my life than I already have.

[Baby Lee]

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Nonetheless that’s a troubling trend.

There is a substantial difference in the way in which Black Panther addressed race (positively, secondary to the story), and F/WS did (negatively, lecturing).

Frankly I don’t need any more of the latter in my life than I already have.

Oh yeah? Maybe you should, . . I dunno, . . . DO BETTER!?!?!