The Chiefs got lucky to win Super Bowls

[BWillie]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

A hand? Yeah.

A tournament? Nah - when I used to play a lot I knew when I was playing well and when I was irritated or chasing or just not focused and playing poorly.

If you're getting cold-decked it's not 'luck' to play in such a way that allows you to ride out your cold spell and then take advantage of it when you start getting better cards. Or to know when to lean on guys when THEY'RE clearly chasing.

There's plenty of skill involved in poker.

I would say there is much more luck involved in poker than you even are giving credit for. In one tournament, I'd rather be one of the worst players in the field and be one of the luckiest and it isn't even close. You can be absolutely awful and win a poker tournament.

When I play online in cash games I win only 53 or 54% of the time in a given cash session. In live cash where the games are much much easier I win about 62% of the time. In one day, one game, luck is the biggest factor of my success.

Over an entire year luck STILL a factor, just not the biggest factor. And in football you are only playing 17 + playoff games so there is that much more of a luck factor than some other sports or games.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by BWillie

I would say there is much more luck involved in poker than you even are giving credit for. In one tournament, I'd rather be one of the worst players in the field and be one of the luckiest and it isn't even close. You can be absolutely awful and win a poker tournament.

When I play online in cash games I win only 53 or 54% of the time in a given cash session. In live cash where the games are much much easier I win about 62% of the time. In one day, one game, luck is the biggest factor of my success.

Over an entire year luck STILL a factor, just not the biggest factor. And in football you are only playing 17 + playoff games so there is that much more of a luck factor than some other sports or games.

I barely count online poker.

There's too many lunatics in those rooms that throw 'calculated decisionmaking' out the window.

When you have 2 or 3 guys throwing hand grenades out there, it changes things quite a bit. So yeah, in online I'd say luck plays a greater role.

[BWillie]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I barely count online poker.

There's too many lunatics in those rooms that throw 'calculated decisionmaking' out the window.

When you have 2 or 3 guys throwing hand grenades out there, it changes things quite a bit. So yeah, in online I'd say luck plays a greater role.

lol what

Online is full of multitabling pros who are making very good calculating decisions. Much less fish as well.

Live is full of plumbers, ditch diggers, wealth managers, drunk guys who have no sound strategy. Luck plays a big factor in both but if your winrate per table live is 10-15x higher than an online game then your variance will be lower and in turn the probability of you winning a given session increases.

If my winrate at a live 5/10 game was the same as an online 5/10 game where I could also play 8 tables, I could probably be a billionaire by the time I died.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by BWillie

lol what

Online is full of multitabling pros who are making very good calculating decisions. Much less fish as well.

Live is full of plumbers, ditch diggers, wealth managers, drunk guys who have no sound strategy. Luck plays a big factor in both but if your winrate per table live is 10-15x higher than an online game then your variance will be lower and in turn the probability of you winning a given session increases.

If my winrate at a live 5/10 game was the same as an online 5/10 game where I could also play 8 tables, I could probably be a billionaire by the time I died.

I've seen WAY more wildcards in online games.

And that's not to say that all of them are - there are absolutely pros online. But it only takes 1 or 2 guys at a table to screw up any sort of dynamic (I've been in rooms where a pro gets pissed and leaves because no amount of 'calculating' will save you when you have a lunatic in there).

I've always found live games to give 'truer' outcomes because you're less likely to have that 1 or 2 people at the table who are playing with their hair on fire. And there are still plenty of those even at 5/10 games.

I never played much beyond the 5/10 games. I suspect at 10/25 you've weeded out most of those really nutty players. Certainly anything beyond that you will have. But it's been my experience that there are still a TON of erratic players all the way up to 5/10 games.