...

kstater · 10-12-2009, 04:45 AM

The sad part is visualizing in graph form how low Herman ****ing Edwards took this team.

InChiefsHeaven · 10-12-2009, 06:05 AM

This is incredible. I don't understand all this stuff, but I'll take you at your word...send this to One Arrowhead Drive and see what they say about it...

Pretty amazing stuff...

ThunderChief · 10-12-2009, 06:16 AM

Really, really stellar and excellent analysis Rain Man. I always thought in my gut that the '71 Chiefs were, up and down the lineup, the best team assembled in KC in spite of that season ending, 6 quarter loss to Miami in the Christmas Bowl game.

And, this 2009 team seems about as bad as those Dark Ages teams from the 75-89 era, so I'd have to say that your analysis is right on the mark, and remarkable.

Jack · 10-12-2009, 07:22 AM

Kudos from a person who absolute abhors stats and such.

I have saved this for future reference. A few trips down memory lane does soften the mental kicks in the gut that any true fan of the term endures these days. . .

I have stored this file away for future reference.

grazie

Jack · 10-12-2009, 10:18 AM

Rain Man

I realize it was a tremendous effort on your part. This shows some glaring issues.

Would it be possible to chart successful franchises such as Pittsburgh, Dallas starting from the same period?

I love how Lamar thumbed his nose at Lombardi and set the stage for the AFL. I just feel his tight hand on the bucks was the single reason for the mediocre squads the Chiefs have fielded.

Thanks

**Mr. Flopnuts** · 10-12-2009, 10:20 AM

The net gain in the 90's rivaled that of our peak in the early 70's. The lesson to be learned from that is we should bring back Marty.

**Rain Man** · 10-12-2009, 10:25 AM

I'd actually really like to do that.

If anyone has time to pull the data down for me for any franchise, I'd appreciate it. PM me and I'll show you what I did. It took me maybe an hour to pull the Chiefs down. It might be longer for older NFC teams and less for younger teams.

DJ's left nut · 10-12-2009, 10:47 AM

When did the 16 game season go into effect? That also gave Peterson a couple more games/season to pad his record during the strong years and would've presumably added a few more points to the Hank teams as well.

Bottomline - great post; we suck hard right now.

bowener · 10-12-2009, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rain Man

The bottom line? If we lose the next 5 games in a row, it will officially be the lowest point of Chiefs civilization.

This is truly impressive work, sir. I would rep you more if I could.

I was wondering if you had the time to create a graph (only) for a successful team, such as the Steelers over the same course of the Chiefs existence. If not them, then somebody like the Pats (curious to see how their graph looked when they went 16-0) who faced hard times as well for a while.

I would like a great team to measure our ineptitude by, you know, to put things into perspective.

Also, is a super bowl win worth +3 or is it more? Is a super bowl berth worth points regardless of win? Something like +3 for appearing in the Super Bowl, but -5 for losing, thus a net of -2 or +7 for loss/win. Seems a franchise that even makes it to the Super Bowl (and loses) has something more to hang their hats on than the teams that do not make it.

This is just another side note:
It would be cool to go back and find the attendance records for each home game, probably would need to be done as a percentage of the capacity of the stadium, for example 77,000 out of 78,000 is considered a sell out, but it is actually 98.72% full. It would be interesting to see at what point the fans give up on attending the games during one of our many long down turns, and at what point they begin to attend in force again (following a string of victories, a new hiring, etc...)

ChiefsCountry · 10-12-2009, 12:03 PM

The 1971 team was the best, the 69 team would be even more if Dawson played the whole year. Livington replacing Dawson was like Cassel replacing Brady.

The Christmas Day Game if you look at it is pretty big one in the history of NFL. It kind of gets swept under the rug but if you look at it is pretty big. If the Chiefs win, more than likely they go to the Super Bowl against the Cowboys. That would mean they would have went to 3 of the first 6 Super Bowls, win it and the Chiefs are talked about as the team of that era instead of Green Bay. Hank Stram and Dawson's legacies would be even more iconic in NFL history. Not to mention our defense would get the credit that they never have really gotten in history. Dallas doesn't win that and more than likely aren't crowned America's Team, instead they are Super Bowl chokers. Miami took the momentum from a Super Bowl run to go undeafted in 1972, do they do that if they get beat in the playoffs the year before?

Its alot of ifs and buts, but it is something to think about.

ThunderChief · 10-12-2009, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry

The 1971 team was the best, the 69 team would be even more if Dawson played the whole year. Livington replacing Dawson was like Cassel replacing Brady.

The Christmas Day Game if you look at it is pretty big one in the history of NFL. It kind of gets swept under the rug but if you look at it is pretty big. If the Chiefs win, more than likely they go to the Super Bowl against the Cowboys. That would mean they would have went to 3 of the first 6 Super Bowls, win it and the Chiefs are talked about as the team of that era instead of Green Bay. Hank Stram and Dawson's legacies would be even more iconic in NFL history. Not to mention our defense would get the credit that they never have really gotten in history. Dallas doesn't win that and more than likely aren't crowned America's Team, instead they are Super Bowl chokers. Miami took the momentum from a Super Bowl run to go undeafted in 1972, do they do that if they get beat in the playoffs the year before?

Its alot of ifs and buts, but it is something to think about.

Let me weigh in by stating that the '71 Christmas Day game between KC and Miami was about the best NFL game I've ever seen, in spite of the outcome. I've never before or since experienced the emotional roller coaster highs and lows of that magnificent game and dare say, no other game comes close in matching it.

What might of been had the Chiefs prevailed that day? Certainly, NFL and Chief's history could and probably would be altered significantly and that's saying something. You make some compellingly interesting points on the outcome of that game, CC, and ones I haven't thought about before now.

**cdcox** · 10-12-2009, 12:15 PM

I don't know if you can say the Chief's D of the glory years never got the recognition they deserved. Four players from that D have been inducted into the HOF and they are routinely mentioned as one of the top 10 defenses of all time. Johnny Robinson is probably the only other guy on that defense that deserved HOF consideration, IMO.

oldandslow · 10-12-2009, 12:45 PM

RM-

Rep. You really should write this up and send it to the Star. It is certainly better than 99% of the tripe you read in the fish wrap.

InChiefsHeaven · 10-12-2009, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldandslow

RM-

Rep. You really should write this up and send it to the Star. It is certainly better than 99% of the tripe you read in the fish wrap.

THat's an awesome idea...seriously!

10-12-2009, 04:45 AM	#2
kstater Custom User Title kstater's Avatar Join Date: Jan 2007	The sad part is visualizing in graph form how low Herman ****ing Edwards took this team.
Posts: 39,215

10-12-2009, 06:05 AM	#3
InChiefsHeaven Rockin' yer FACE OFF! InChiefsHeaven's Avatar Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Omaha, Nebraska	This is incredible. I don't understand all this stuff, but I'll take you at your word...send this to One Arrowhead Drive and see what they say about it... Pretty amazing stuff...
Posts: 25,955

10-12-2009, 06:16 AM	#4
ThunderChief Starter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: N Florida	Really, really stellar and excellent analysis Rain Man. I always thought in my gut that the '71 Chiefs were, up and down the lineup, the best team assembled in KC in spite of that season ending, 6 quarter loss to Miami in the Christmas Bowl game. And, this 2009 team seems about as bad as those Dark Ages teams from the 75-89 era, so I'd have to say that your analysis is right on the mark, and remarkable.
Posts: 70

10-12-2009, 07:22 AM	#5
Jack Starter Jack's Avatar Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Centralia, WA	Kudos from a person who absolute abhors stats and such. I have saved this for future reference. A few trips down memory lane does soften the mental kicks in the gut that any true fan of the term endures these days. . . I have stored this file away for future reference. grazie
Posts: 616

10-12-2009, 10:18 AM	#6
Jack Starter Jack's Avatar Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Centralia, WA	Rain Man I realize it was a tremendous effort on your part. This shows some glaring issues. Would it be possible to chart successful franchises such as Pittsburgh, Dallas starting from the same period? I love how Lamar thumbed his nose at Lombardi and set the stage for the AFL. I just feel his tight hand on the bucks was the single reason for the mediocre squads the Chiefs have fielded. Thanks
Posts: 616

10-12-2009, 10:20 AM	#7
Mr. Flopnuts FINALLY! The wait is over. Mr. Flopnuts's Avatar Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Future Is Now!!!	The net gain in the 90's rivaled that of our peak in the early 70's. The lesson to be learned from that is we should bring back Marty.
Posts: 56,649

10-12-2009, 10:25 AM	#8
Rain Man NFL's #1 Ermines Fan Rain Man's Avatar Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house	I'd actually really like to do that. If anyone has time to pull the data down for me for any franchise, I'd appreciate it. PM me and I'll show you what I did. It took me maybe an hour to pull the Chiefs down. It might be longer for older NFC teams and less for younger teams.
Posts: 142,034

10-12-2009, 10:47 AM	#9
DJ's left nut Sauntering Vaguely Downwards DJ's left nut's Avatar Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Columbia, Mo	When did the 16 game season go into effect? That also gave Peterson a couple more games/season to pad his record during the strong years and would've presumably added a few more points to the Hank teams as well. Bottomline - great post; we suck hard right now.
Posts: 61,246

10-12-2009, 12:03 PM	#11
ChiefsCountry The Insider ChiefsCountry's Avatar Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Lake of the Ozarks	The 1971 team was the best, the 69 team would be even more if Dawson played the whole year. Livington replacing Dawson was like Cassel replacing Brady. The Christmas Day Game if you look at it is pretty big one in the history of NFL. It kind of gets swept under the rug but if you look at it is pretty big. If the Chiefs win, more than likely they go to the Super Bowl against the Cowboys. That would mean they would have went to 3 of the first 6 Super Bowls, win it and the Chiefs are talked about as the team of that era instead of Green Bay. Hank Stram and Dawson's legacies would be even more iconic in NFL history. Not to mention our defense would get the credit that they never have really gotten in history. Dallas doesn't win that and more than likely aren't crowned America's Team, instead they are Super Bowl chokers. Miami took the momentum from a Super Bowl run to go undeafted in 1972, do they do that if they get beat in the playoffs the year before? Its alot of ifs and buts, but it is something to think about.
Posts: 50,199

10-12-2009, 12:15 PM	#13
cdcox www.nfl-forecast.com cdcox's Avatar Join Date: Sep 2000	I don't know if you can say the Chief's D of the glory years never got the recognition they deserved. Four players from that D have been inducted into the HOF and they are routinely mentioned as one of the top 10 defenses of all time. Johnny Robinson is probably the only other guy on that defense that deserved HOF consideration, IMO.
Posts: 45,553

10-12-2009, 12:45 PM	#14
oldandslow Veteran Join Date: Apr 2004	RM- Rep. You really should write this up and send it to the Star. It is certainly better than 99% of the tripe you read in the fish wrap.
Posts: 4,572