***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***

[JakeF]

A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana

Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.

Originally Posted by Dartgod

People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.

California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.

“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”

The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.

The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”

Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.

The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.

The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.

A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.

Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.

“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”

It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.

“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”

On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.

“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”

According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.

More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.

But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.

“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”

CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.

Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.

“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”

[Donger]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

Its fairly obvious to spot people like Donger who use google as their entire resource on any topic and have zero real world experience with pretty much anything and think they are an expert.

Newsflash Donger, 90% of testing sights wont test you if you don't have symptoms regardless of your potential exposure. Its simply a waste of time.

There is no set number of days after exposure to know you have had enough incubation time therefore testing prior to being symptomatic is a waste of time unless you test at least 10 days after exposure. At that point if you have been asymptomatic for 10 days there is likely no reason to get tested anyway as it will take 2 days to get the test back (maybe longer) and quarantine time frame is 14 days. Its simple PRACTICAL logic.

There is no need to burden the system with asymptomatic testing.

This isn't complicated to comprehend if you have half a functioning brain.

I'm not an expert on this, nor have I claimed to be. I'm not an infectious disease specialist. Fauci is. I'm not a virologist. Redfield is.

Again, if you think you know more than them on this subject, knock yourself out. I think you'll find yourself rather alone in that arrogance.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by O.city

The issue is if asymptomatic people are really driving spread, we need to know.

Dr. Marcellus says it's a waste of time. So, there's that.

[dirk digler]

If we had the virus under control and had the testing capability then you definitely would want to test any person (asymptomatic or symptomatic) who had a close contact with an infected person multiple times and they need to quarantine.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by dirk digler

If we had the virus under control and had the testing capability then you definitely would want to test any person (asymptomatic or symptomatic) who had a close contact with an infected person multiple times and they need to quarantine.

And if a lack of capacity (or alleged lack of capacity) is the reason for changing the guidelines, state that. But we know that some people who get infected are asymptomatic. Is there any reason to believe that such people are not shedding the virus?

[stumppy]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

Its fairly obvious to spot people like Donger who use google as their entire resource on any topic and have zero real world experience with pretty much anything and think they are an expert.

Newsflash Donger, 90% of testing sights wont test you if you don't have symptoms regardless of your potential exposure. Its simply a waste of time.

There is no set number of days after exposure to know you have had enough incubation time therefore testing prior to being symptomatic is a waste of time unless you test at least 10 days after exposure. At that point if you have been asymptomatic for 10 days there is likely no reason to get tested anyway as it will take 2 days to get the test back (maybe longer) and quarantine time frame is 14 days. Its simple PRACTICAL logic.

There is no need to burden the system with asymptomatic testing.

This isn't complicated to comprehend if you have half a functioning brain.

Could you be more transparent? There's only one reason you've jumped on the 'no testing' train.

[dirk digler]

Originally Posted by Donger

And if a lack of capacity (or alleged lack of capacity) is the reason for changing the guidelines, state that. But we know that some people who get infected are asymptomatic. Is there any reason to believe that such people are not shedding the virus?

Not that I am aware of.

We also need to do large scale surveillance testing to find out how prevalent the virus is in communities but not to manipulate data like the State of Missouri does.

[eDave]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

Its fairly obvious to spot people like Donger who use google as their entire resource on any topic and have zero real world experience with pretty much anything and think they are an expert.

Newsflash Donger, 90% of testing sights wont test you if you don't have symptoms regardless of your potential exposure. Its simply a waste of time.

There is no set number of days after exposure to know you have had enough incubation time therefore testing prior to being symptomatic is a waste of time unless you test at least 10 days after exposure. At that point if you have been asymptomatic for 10 days there is likely no reason to get tested anyway as it will take 2 days to get the test back (maybe longer) and quarantine time frame is 14 days. Its simple PRACTICAL logic.

There is no need to burden the system with asymptomatic testing.

This isn't complicated to comprehend if you have half a functioning brain.

Learn all that on the internet?

[petegz28]

Originally Posted by O.city

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/...cid=mm6933a3_w

Big prison serology report. 12x more infections than we caught?

But did 12x more die?

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by O.city

The issue is if asymptomatic people are really driving spread, we need to know.

Testing asymptomatic people because of potential exposure has nothing to do with that, that's a totally different topic.

Mass testing and then contact tracing of positives is the only thing that would tell us about that and that has nothing to do with the CDC guideline change.

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by eDave

Learn all that on the internet?

No dipshit I deal with it daily at work. Any other questions?

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by dirk digler

If we had the virus under control and had the testing capability then you definitely would want to test any person (asymptomatic or symptomatic) who had a close contact with an infected person multiple times and they need to quarantine.

There is literally zero benefit to this. I have no idea where you guys get these ideas.

[eDave]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

No dipshit I deal with it daily at work. Any other questions?

Nope. Thanks.

[petegz28]

CDC defends controversial new guidance for coronavirus testing: ‘Everyone who wants a test does not necessarily need a test’

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is defending its controversial new guidance on coronavirus testing following outcry from various medical groups and allegations of political intervention.

Earlier this week, the CDC quietly revised its guidance on coronavirus testing, dropping its previous recommendation to test everyone who’s come into close contact with a person infected with Covid-19 — even those who don’t have symptoms. The agency previously advised testing everyone with a “recent known or suspected exposure” to the virus, saying the virus can be transmitted a few days before symptoms show as well as by asymptomatic people who never develop them.

Medical groups and some lawmakers raised concern about the new guidance, saying that early and widespread testing of people without symptoms can help contain the outbreak in the U.S.

The CDC, which referred calls to the Department of Health and Human Services all day Wednesday, defended the change in a statement from CDC Director Dr. Robert Redfield released around 10 p.m. Wednesday night.

“Everyone who needs a COVID-19 test, can get a test,” Redfield said. “Everyone who wants a test does not necessarily need a test; the key is to engage the needed public health community in the decision with the appropriate follow-up action.”

Redfield said the new guidelines were “coordinated in conjunction with the White House Coronavirus Task Force,” adding that they “received appropriate attention, consultation and input from task force experts.”

On a conference call with reporters on Wednesday, Assistant Secretary for Health Adm. Brett Giroir, who leads the Trump administration’s testing effort, defended the policy change, saying it empowers local health officials and clinicians. He also denied allegations of bowing to political pressure from the Trump administration.

“Let me tell you, right up front that the new guidelines are a CDC action,” he said, adding that members of the White House coronavirus task force, including Dr. Anthony Fauci and Redfield, discussed and agreed on the new guidelines.

But Fauci later told CNN’s chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta that he “was under general anesthesia in the operating room and was not part of any discussion or deliberation regarding the new testing recommendations.”

The New York Times reported later Wednesday that two federal health officials said the CDC was pressured into changing the guidance from top officials at the White House and HHS.

“There was no weight on the scales by the president or the vice president or Secretary Azar,” Giroir said on the call, referring to HHS Secretary Alex Azar. “We all signed off on it, the docs, before it ever got to a place where the political leadership would have even seen it, and this document was approved by the task force by consensus.”

It remains unclear exactly where the new guidance originated, though Giroir said it was a “CDC action.” Regardless of who is responsible for the updated guidance, a former CDC director, epidemiologists and medical associations have criticized the update as a setback in efforts to fight the coronavirus in the U.S.

The Infectious Diseases Society of America and the HIV Medicine Association called for the “immediate reversal” of the update in a joint statement.

“It is essential that public health guidelines be rooted in the best available scientific evidence,” the two groups said. “Testing asymptomatic individuals who have been exposed to a person with COVID-19 remains a critical evidence-based strategy for containing the pandemic and reducing transmission.”

New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo and California Gov. Gavin Newsom, both Democrats, said their states will continue testing asymptomatic people.

“We’re not going to follow the CDC guidance. I consider it political propaganda. I would caution private companies against following the CDC guidance. I think it is wholly indefensible on its face. I think it is inherently self-contradictory. It is the exact opposite of what the CDC has been saying,” Cuomo said on a conference call with reporters Wednesday. “So either the CDC is schizophrenic or they are admitting error in their first position or this is just political dictations.”

Cuomo pointed to comments previously made by President Donald Trump in June in which he said “testing is a double-edged sword.” He added that he directed officials to “slow the testing down, please.” White House officials later said the president had been “clearly speaking in jest.”

“The utter failure to establish a robust national testing system is the very core of President Trump’s incompetence in handling the pandemic,” Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer said in a statement Wednesday. “He thinks that by ignoring the truth of 180,000 deaths he can just sweep COVID-19 under the rug and no one will notice his failures. But his denial only makes things worse.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/27/cdc-...s-testing.html

[Marcellus]

You guys can get back to your echo chamber of thought now.

[petegz28]

Originally Posted by O.city

The issue is if asymptomatic people are really driving spread, we need to know.

Testing positive is not the same as testing for the ability to spread, right?