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Couch-Potato · 10-10-2023, 08:45 PM

Some interesting WRs in the upcoming class, who do you like?

1st - 2nd RD WR Targets:

Keon Coleman, FSU, 6-4, 215, 4.6
Emeka Egbuka, OH ST, 6-1, 205, 4.3
Adonai Mitchell, TX, 6-4, 195, 4.5
Troy Franklin, ORG, 6-3, 185, 4.41
Xavier Legette, SC, 6-1, 225, 4.29
Brian Thomas, LSU, 6-4, 205, 4.35
Xavier Worthy, TX, 6-1, 175, 4.22
Ja'Lynn Polk, WAS, 6-2, 205, 4.48
Johnny Wilson, FSU, 6-7, 235, 4.42
Branden Rice, USC, 6-3, 210, 4.38
Malachi Corley, WKU, 5-11, 200, 4.46
Jermain Burton, BAMA, 6-0, 195, 4.31

*This entire class is tall WTF?

Chris Meck · 12-13-2023, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Couch-Potato

Both Xavier's feel like boom or bust types currently.

Leggette scares me as a prospect. Nothing in 4 years and then all of the sudden, he's Megatron. He's either stupid, or juicing, or very lazy unless it's time to get paid. Something ain't right there.

Worthy, my only concern is his size. Is he a slot only guy at the NFL level? I mean, that's fine, but do you want to take that in the first round? If Rice is your 'X' moving forward, I guess that's alright.

staylor26 · 12-13-2023, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

Leggette scares me as a prospect. Nothing in 4 years and then all of the sudden, he's Megatron. He's either stupid, or juicing, or very lazy unless it's time to get paid. Something ain't right there.

Worthy, my only concern is his size. Is he a slot only guy at the NFL level? I mean, that's fine, but do you want to take that in the first round? If Rice is your 'X' moving forward, I guess that's alright.

Orrr he's just a late bloomer? Lol it doesn't have to be something bad dude.

I'd be more concerned if he didn't look like a ****ing A.J. Brown clone and didn't do it in the SEC against the best of the best.

The guy is 6'3" 227 with wheels. You just can't teach that, and that tends to translate well.

Couch-Potato · 12-13-2023, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staylor26

Orrr he's just a late bloomer? Lol it doesn't have to be something bad dude.

I'd be more concerned if he didn't look like a ****ing A.J. Brown clone and didn't do it in the SEC against the best of the best.

The guy is 6'3" 227 with wheels. You just can't teach that, and that tends to translate well.

I also thought he looked more like A.J. Brown then D.K. Metcalf on tape.

Stryker · 12-13-2023, 08:19 PM

ESPN Matt Miller 1st round mock:

1. Chicago Bears (via 1-12 CAR)

Caleb Williams, QB, USC

The Bears have a tough decision to make at quarterback given how well Justin Fields has played since his return from a right thumb injury a month ago. But he has been inconsistent over three seasons, and Chicago would likely take a quarterback if it lands one of the top two selections in the draft. Williams being available makes it an easier call, too.

Williams is a big play waiting to happen, with 41 total touchdowns in 2023. His game combines great arm strength, mobility, poise and field vision to make him the best overall prospect in the class and a quarterback the Bears simply cannot afford to pass on for another year of Fields. Restarting the clock at the position -- both in terms of salary and development timeline -- now is crucial with Fields' fifth-year option decision on deck.

2. New England Patriots (3-10)
Drake Maye, QB, North Carolina

Much like Chicago, the Patriots need to start over at quarterback, especially because the entire organization could reset this offseason. Mac Jones' fifth-year option decision is also coming this offseason, and after he was benched for Bailey Zappe, all signs point toward a new QB1 in New England for 2024.

Maye is a powerful thrower at 6-foot-4 and 230 pounds, with the arm talent to stretch the field vertically and the mobility to threaten on the ground. There are times his ball placement can be inconsistent, but his supporting cast at North Carolina did him few favors there. Maye -- who is declaring for the draft -- has the traits of a true franchise quarterback.

3. Arizona Cardinals (3-10)
Marvin Harrison Jr., WR, Ohio State

I believe the Cardinals will make the right decision here to build around quarterback Kyler Murray and draft an elite receiver prospect to be his running mate, rather than make a change under center. Murray has played well since returning from a torn ACL, and the Cards have receivers Marquise Brown and Greg Dortch both on expiring deals.

Harrison is a magician at 6-foot-4 with fantastic body control and the fastest hands of any receiver in the draft class. He has the smooth and effortless route running ability -- plus the top-tier body control -- to quickly become one of the best players at the position in the NFL. He'd be the 10th receiver to ever get picked this high, per ESPN Stats & Information research.

4. New York Giants (5-8)
Jayden Daniels, QB, LSU

Is this too early for Daniels, even after his brilliant Heisman-winning 2023 season? Maybe, but teams will overdraft at quarterback in an effort to find the right player, and Daniels' dual-threat ability and vertical passing traits are very intriguing. His 50 total touchdowns this season make him a first-round candidate, but it's Daniels' improvement in the pocket and the best deep ball in college football that will truly turn heads come draft time.

The Giants are invested financially in Daniel Jones, but his play simply hasn't been good enough, and New York can move on via a trade. His 38.4 QBR ranks 25th in the NFL, and his season is over with a torn ACL. Daniels' 95.7, meanwhile, leads the FBS. And sure, undrafted rookie Tommy DeVito has been a fun story, leading the Giants to three straight wins. But his QBR on the season? It's even worse than Jones' at 26.2.

play
1:25
Where does Mel Kiper Jr. have Jayden Daniels on his big board?Mel Kiper Jr. explains how Jayden Daniels rose from a midround pick to number eight overall on his big board.

5. Washington Commanders (4-9)
Olumuyiwa Fashanu, OT, Penn State

First-year starting quarterback Sam Howell has likely shown enough bright spots for the Commanders to build around him for at least one more season. But they can't keep this current offensive line intact with Howell on track to set the single-season sacks taken record (58 in 13 games).

Fashanu is a smooth-moving left tackle who has allowed one sack all season at Penn State. The 20-year-old junior is still developing, but he has Laremy Tunsil-like potential.

6. Tennessee Titans (5-8)
Dallas Turner, EDGE, Alabama

An offensive playmaker is very much in play for the Titans here, but this is a team without a double-digit sack player on the current roster. Outside linebackers Harold Landry III (8.5) and Arden Key (5.0) are talented, but the chance to get the best defensive player in the entire draft should excite Tennessee. The Titans have many needs at premium positions, so the best player available approach makes sense, and they can then find a pass-catcher or left tackle on Day 2. Turner has nine sacks this season.

7. Las Vegas Raiders (5-8)
J.J. McCarthy, QB, Michigan

Could the Raiders roll with Aidan O'Connell in 2024? Sure, but all signs right now point to them starting over at quarterback with a new regime in place, even after signing Jimmy Garoppolo in the 2023 offseason. McCarthy is instinctive, efficient and effective as a second-effort creator outside of the pocket. The Michigan scheme does him no favors in terms of statistics, but NFL scouts continue to tell me that McCarthy will be drafted earlier than expected.

With Shedeur Sanders (Colorado) and Quinn Ewers (Texas) expected to return to college for the 2024 season, McCarthy is the lone first-round-caliber passer remaining on my board. And if things play out this way, this would be the quickest that four QBs have come off the board in the common draft era (since 1967), per ESPN Stats & Information.

8. Chicago Bears (5-8)
Malik Nabers, WR, LSU

The Bears have receiver DJ Moore and tight end Cole Kmet, but with Darnell Mooney struggling to develop into a consistent threat and set to hit free agency, they could stand to add more options -- especially if they are taking a rookie quarterback in Williams at No. 1. Nabers is the most explosive after-the-catch receiver in the draft -- he averages 6.8 yards after the catch per reception -- and I like to compare him to Stefon Diggs. You might wonder about a left tackle here, but I'm a believer in second-year player Braxton Jones, so Chicago would be wise to go receiver at No. 8.

EDITOR'S PICKS

Welcome to NFL draft season: 30 questions on QBs, standout prospects, intriguing teams
8dMel Kiper Jr., +3 More

Rankings for the 2024 NFL draft: Top prospects at every position from Kiper, Miller, Reid and Yates
12dMel Kiper Jr., +3 More

Kiper: How Heisman Trophy winner Jayden Daniels projects to the NFL
4dMel Kiper Jr.

9. New York Jets (5-8)
Joe Alt, OT, Notre Dame

The Jets appear to be all-in on the return of Aaron Rodgers, fixing what ails them most in 2024. But if that's the case, a major upgrade is needed along the offensive line. New York has allowed 55 sacks, third most in the NFL, and Zach Wilson & Co. have been pressured at the fifth-highest rate (36%).

Alt is a pro-ready starter on the left side with one sack allowed all season. Given the turnstile that has been the Jets' left tackle position, upgrading via the early portion of the first round feels like a must after missing out on the top offensive tackles in the 2023 draft.

10. Los Angeles Chargers (5-8)
Brock Bowers, TE, Georgia

Bowers is my No. 6 overall player, but I couldn't find a value/need fit for him earlier than No. 10. Los Angeles wouldn't complain. The Chargers could luck out and get an awesome middle-of-the-field target who has similarities to George Kittle as a route runner, pass-catcher and after-the-catch playmaker. Bowers has 26 receiving touchdowns in the past three seasons and would immediately give quarterback Justin Herbert a chain-mover.

11. Atlanta Falcons (6-7)
Terrion Arnold, CB, Alabama

The Falcons miss out on the top quarterbacks here and instead look to bolster the defense with my CB1. Arnold, a 6-foot-2 redshirt sophomore, has five interceptions in 2023 while showing a physicality rarely seen from young cornerbacks in the run game. He's long and aggressive, and he has the ball skills to be a star opposite A.J. Terrell.

12. Seattle Seahawks (6-7)
Jared Verse, EDGE, Florida State

A powerful pass-rusher who can set the edge against the run is exactly what Seattle needs in a draft class weak at defensive tackle (another potential hole for the Seahawks). Verse can bounce inside or outside opponent offensive tackles at 260 pounds, and he plays very similar to Trey Hendrickson. Verse -- who transferred from Albany before the 2022 season -- has been on a hot streak and has nine sacks through the end of the regular season, showing he is getting better with more reps and experience.

13. New Orleans Saints (6-7)
Keon Coleman, WR, Florida State

A quarterback of the future would be lovely here -- Derek Carr has 13 touchdown passes to seven interceptions this season -- but the value simply isn't there. Instead, the Saints can get a top-flight running mate for Chris Olave. Coleman is a 6-foot-4 pass-catcher with enough explosive ability that FSU used him as its primary punt returner. The former prep basketball star stands out with the ball in his hands and when attacking defenses on 50-50 balls.

If New Orleans did want to add to the QB room, it could maybe look at Bo Nix (Oregon) or Michael Penix Jr. (Washington) as Day 2 options.

14. Pittsburgh Steelers (7-6)
Rome Odunze, WR, Washington

Diontae Johnson's contract expires at the end of 2024, so there's room for Pittsburgh to add a physical, downfield threat with elite after-the-catch ability to the depth chart. Odunze has been the WR1 at Washington for three seasons, catching 25 touchdowns in that time while proving himself to be one of the most physical wideouts in college football. The 6-foot-3, 215-pound Odunze could pair with George Pickens to form a duo that would rival Cincinnati's WR group in the AFC North.

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0:31
Rome Odunze makes big-time TD catch for WashingtonMichael Penix Jr. throws a 40-yard TD dime to Rome Odunze to give Washington the lead.

15. Los Angeles Rams (6-7)
Tyler Guyton, OT, Oklahoma

The Rams might have found a left tackle of the future with Alaric Jackson, but the right side has been an issue this season with Rob Havenstein manning the position. Guyton -- a raw but highly mobile blocker -- is my pick for who will be the position's biggest riser during the pre-draft process. The former defensive lineman is still learning to play offensive tackle, but his agility in space as a run-blocker is fantastic, and his length in pass protection is ideal for a rookie starter.

16. Indianapolis Colts (7-6)
Kool-Aid McKinstry, CB, Alabama

The Colts could be looking at wide receiver if free agent Michael Pittman Jr. isn't retained, but the front office will likely do all it can to keep him on the roster for young quarterback Anthony Richardson.

Instead, the Colts could look to the defense, where the secondary has been plagued by injuries and poor play. McKinstry entered this season as my top-ranked cornerback and then broke up six passes over 13 games while allowing a 32.1% completion percentage (tied for 16th-best in the country). The 6-foot-1, 195-pounder hasn't recorded an interception this season but has quick feet in coverage and great length to lock down top wideouts.

17. Denver Broncos (7-6)
Ennis Rakestraw Jr., CB, Missouri

Denver has a set of budding stars in Pat Surtain II and Ja'Quan McMillian at corner, but since McMillian plays inside, it still needs an outside cover guy opposite Surtain. Rakestraw is long-armed at 6-foot and 188 pounds, and his technique, quickness and instincts are that of a starting NFL cornerback. Turn on the film from the LSU-Mizzou game back in October, and you'll see Rakestraw get challenged just one time all day by the LSU passing offense.

18. Cincinnati Bengals (7-6)
Jer'Zhan Newton, DT, Illinois

Free agency will be huge in truly determining the Bengals' draft needs; wide receivers Tee Higgins and Tyler Boyd are currently set to hit the open market. We're operating here under the belief that at least one will be back in 2024. If it plays out that way, the Bengals can bypass receiver in this spot and grab the best interior defender in the class. Newton is slightly undersized at 6-foot-2 and 295 pounds, but he has a devastating first step and has used it to accumulate 16.5 sacks and 92 pressures over the past three seasons.

What to know for the 2024 NFL draft

• Mocks: Top 10 debate | Miller | Reid
• Ranks: Kiper | Yates | Miller | Positions
• 30 big questions » | QB Hot Board »
• Grades and reports » | Order » | More »

19. Tampa Bay Buccaneers (6-7)
Xavier Worthy, WR, Texas

Mike Evans is potentially hitting free agency in March, and even if the perennial 1,000-yard receiver returns, he will turn 31 years old in August. It's time for Tampa Bay to invest in a younger top-tier pass-catcher, at least as long as one of the top four quarterbacks doesn't slip to No. 19. Worthy is fast and elusive with big-play ability. He has scored 25 touchdowns for Texas during the past three seasons and is a blur with the ball in his hands.

20. Arizona Cardinals (via 7-6 HOU)
Kalen King, CB, Penn State

After adding Harrison at No. 3 to help boost the offense, I could see the Cardinals focusing on cornerback with their second first-rounder further down the board. King was rated higher by NFL scouts than former Penn State teammate Joey Porter Jr. (No. 33 in the 2023 draft), and while he isn't as physical as Porter, he has better timing and ball skills. The Cardinals' pass defense -- which is allowing 7.0 yards per pass attempt, 26th in the NFL -- would improve with the feisty 5-foot-11, 191-pounder lined up outside. King has three interceptions and 19 pass breakups over his career.

21. Green Bay Packers (6-7)
JC Latham, OT, Alabama

Since the Packers have a solid young offensive nucleus at quarterback, wide receiver and tight end, they can focus on the line in the draft. The Packers haven't added a non-QB player on offense in Round 1 since 2011 (Derek Sherrod), but they could use some protection for Jordan Love. Latham is a massive blocker on the right side at 6-foot-6 and 360 pounds, and he moves exceptionally well up to the second level and in space. He's powerful enough to handle NFL rushers, too, and has allowed just two sacks in his three years at Alabama.

22. Minnesota Vikings (7-6)
Nate Wiggins, CB, Clemson

The Vikings are desperate for a franchise quarterback but probably won't be picking high enough to get a top passer in this class. Maybe they bring back Kirk Cousins? Maybe they sign someone else or address it further down the board? Either way, I like them adding a top-flight cornerback here at No. 22 if QB isn't an option. People at Clemson say Wiggins is the fastest player on the Tigers' roster, and he does it at 6-foot-2. He played his best football down the stretch of the 2023 regular season before declaring for the draft and has true CB1 traits.

23. Buffalo Bills (7-6)
Laiatu Latu, EDGE, UCLA

The Bills need to add an explosive playmaker, whether it be on offense or defense. And in this projection, the draft's most productive pass-rusher is waiting for them at No. 23. Latu, who medically retired from football while at Washington and then transferred to UCLA in 2022, has posted 23.5 sacks over the past two seasons. Medicals will obviously be huge for his evaluation, but based on tape alone, Latu has top-10-pick upside. His game is similar to that of Jaelan Phillips, thanks to his size (6-foot-5, 265 pounds), length and first-step speed.

24. Houston Texans (via 8-5 CLE)
Chop Robinson, EDGE, Penn State

Will Anderson Jr., the Texans' No. 3 selection back in April, has been amazing as a rookie, but the Texans need a consistent playmaker opposite him. The 255-pound Robinson doesn't have the biggest build, but he is super explosive off the snap and used that quickness to grab 11.5 sacks over the past three seasons at Penn State before declaring for the draft. He isn't a run-down defender yet, but his ability to get to the quarterback will help Houston's defense immediately. The Texans rank 23rd in sack percentage, recording one on 6.1% of opponent dropbacks.

25. Jacksonville Jaguars (8-5)
Xavier Legette, WR, South Carolina

The Jaguars have speed (Christian Kirk) and precision (Calvin Ridley) at wideout but lack power. That's what Legette brings at 6-foot-3 and 227 pounds. The senior caught 73 passes for 1,255 yards and seven touchdowns while outmuscling defensive backs on breaking routes and with the ball in his hands. The Jaguars appear set on the offensive line and could maybe add a pass-rusher, but Legette is too good of a value to pass up here.

26. Detroit Lions (9-4)
Brian Thomas Jr., WR, LSU

The Lions drafted a running back (Jahmyr Gibbs) and linebacker (Jack Campbell) in Round 1 back in April, but let's get them back to adding premium positions with early picks with a talented wide receiver. Thomas can play opposite Amon-Ra St. Brown as a 6-foot-4 red-zone target. He has 60 catches -- with 15 scores -- while averaging 18 yards per reception this season, and he'd be a physical mismatch for Jared Goff and the offense.

27. Kansas City Chiefs (8-5)
Adonai Mitchell, WR, Texas

Another receiver? This makes it eight in Round 1, which would break the standing record of seven set in 2004. But this WR class is dominant, and the Chiefs obviously need one.

The Chiefs lead the NFL in dropped passes (29), and go-to tight end Travis Kelce is in his age-34 season. It's time to upgrade the pass-catchers on the roster for Patrick Mahomes. Mitchell is a playmaker who moves the chains at 6-foot-4 and 200 pounds. He also has 10 touchdowns on 51 catches (just one drop) this season and consistently comes up big in crucial moments for the Longhorns.

28. Dallas Cowboys (10-3)
JT Tuimoloau, EDGE, Ohio State

There isn't a clear-cut need in Dallas right now. Maybe a WR2 makes sense, or maybe some more depth at cornerback, though this team looks pretty complete at the moment. But the potential to add another pass-rusher fits with how the Cowboys like to build their roster. Tuimoloau wasn't overly productive at Ohio State -- 10 sacks over three years -- but he plays his best in big games, including four career sacks against Penn State last season. He's a heavy-handed defensive end who also shows up against the run.

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29. Philadelphia Eagles (10-3)
Kamari Lassiter, CB, Georgia

A Georgia defender to the Eagles? We've seen it before! And it seems to work well for Philly.

Lassiter isn't the front-seven playmaker that GM Howie Roseman loves to draft in Round 1, but the secondary could use major upgrades considering that Darius Slay and James Bradberry will both be at least 31 years old come Week 1 of next season. The Eagles took Kelee Ringo in Round 4 last April and signed Eli Ricks and Josh Jobe as undrafted free agents over the past two years, but it's time to invest in a premium prospect at the position. Lassiter has seven pass breakups this season and has allowed just nine receptions.

30. Miami Dolphins (9-4)
Kingsley Suamataia, OT, BYU

Do the Dolphins need a left tackle? Not yet -- but Terron Armstead turns 33 next July, and there is a potential out in his contract following the 2024 season. For a roster with very few immediate needs, Miami can draft ahead, prepping Suamataia to be the future at left tackle. The BYU senior is the most active, physical left tackle I've studied this year, but he's also really good in space in the run game and moves smoothly in pass protection. He'd be a great fit for the Dolphins' scheme.

31. Baltimore Ravens (10-3)
Chris Braswell, EDGE, Alabama

The Ravens are getting career-year production from Jadeveon Clowney at one edge position, but he's playing on a one-year deal. Flipping the talent on the edge of the defense is always a focal point for this front office, and Braswell is tailor-made for the Ravens' scheme at 6-foot-3 and 255 pounds. He has great power when setting the edge in the run game, and he has added eight sacks and 13 tackles for loss so far this season.

Braswell would be the 13th prospect taken on the defensive side of the ball in this scenario -- we've only seen that few Day 1 defensive players 21 times in the common draft era, per ESPN Stats & Information.

32. San Francisco 49ers (10-3)
Taliese Fuaga, OT, Oregon State

The right side of the 49ers' offensive line has been a weakness this season in both run and passing situations, while right tackle Colton McKivitz has allowed nine sacks and has the team's worst pass block win rate (88%). Normally, San Francisco might not find a solid OT picking at No. 32, but this class is deep. In fact, this would be the fifth time in common draft era history that at least six offensive tackles were taken in Round 1, per ESPN Stats & Information.

Fuaga is a powerful but agile run-blocker at 330 pounds, and since he already operates in a wide zone-running scheme at Oregon State, he would be a plug-and-play transition into the 49ers' offense. Cornerback is definitely a potential consideration here, too, but Fuaga is too nice of a scheme fit and too big of a positional need to go any other direction

Should we stand pat and take Adonai Mitchell or trade up with the Texans and take Xavier Legette?

DJ's left nut · 12-13-2023, 09:59 PM

Rakestraw in the 1st? Damn - I love the kid and I don't have him that high. I figured mid/late 2nd for him - mid 1st? Wow. I just don't see it.

Honestly I'd take Abrams-Draine ahead of him.

I almost wonder if Miller didn't get his Mizzou CBs confused.

Chris Meck · 12-14-2023, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staylor26

Orrr he's just a late bloomer? Lol it doesn't have to be something bad dude.

I'd be more concerned if he didn't look like a ****ing A.J. Brown clone and didn't do it in the SEC against the best of the best.

The guy is 6'3" 227 with wheels. You just can't teach that, and that tends to translate well.

I don't know, man.

FOUR YEARS of just nothing. Nothing at all.

Coogs · 12-14-2023, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

I don't know, man.

FOUR YEARS of just nothing. Nothing at all.

He did have a new OC this year. I have no idea if that is relevant to the situation or not. His old one is the OC for the Huskers. The Huskers offense was nothing to write home about this season.

duncan_idaho · 12-14-2023, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

I don't know, man.

FOUR YEARS of just nothing. Nothing at all.

The first three years (two under Muschamp, one under Beamer), the QB situation was awful and the offense was terrible as a result.

Last year with Rattler was a lot better, and Antoine Wells was the main beneficiary. If he hadn’t gone down I’m not sure Legette breaks out.

I think there’s some context suppressing his production, there.

O.city · 12-14-2023, 08:44 AM

Don't take the 8th best WR prospect. Trade up or trade for someone.

DJ's left nut · 12-14-2023, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Don't take the 8th best WR prospect. Trade up or trade for someone.

Yeah, that's kinda where I am as well.

That said, if the 8th 'best' WR prospect is the 5th best fit on our board and we don't think a true year 1 player is going to be there for us in the 2nd, I can live with that kind of move.

(Especially if they go get McMillan for me in the 2nd)

Couch-Potato · 12-14-2023, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Don't take the 8th best WR prospect. Trade up or trade for someone.

Might be tough for us to pursue a vet unless we let CJ go, but I do wonder who we could get with that 1st > gambling on a rookie to become a #1 WR.

Heck, I don't think we'd even need to spend a 1st for a vet WR addition. I wonder if TEN would move Hopkins last year on his contract for a 4th should they decide to rebuild younger. Maybe Jamison Williams on a Toney'esque deal...not sure who'd be available but praying for a good deal to come along.

DJ's left nut · 12-14-2023, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

The first three years (two under Muschamp, one under Beamer), the QB situation was awful and the offense was terrible as a result.

Last year with Rattler was a lot better, and Antoine Wells was the main beneficiary. If he hadn’t gone down I’m not sure Legette breaks out.

I think there’s some context suppressing his production, there.

My issue is that he feels a little redundant. Another 'power' receiver.

Egbuka is still on the board in his mock, no? That's the route I'd go. Better deep speed, extremely polished in his movement (doesn't lose speed in/out of his breaks), was very productive against top competition, seems to be a very instinctual player.

If Egbuka were somehow the 8th WR drafted and we had a chance to make him that guy, I'd sprint to the board to get it done. The idea of him and Rice as the long-term foundation of the WR corps is extremely exciting to me. Then you can have Toney as a 3rd guy who gives you whatever you get from him (and of course, McMillan).

duncan_idaho · 12-14-2023, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

My issue is that he feels a little redundant. Another 'power' receiver.

Egbuka is still on the board in his mock, no? That's the route I'd go. Better deep speed, extremely polished in his movement (doesn't lose speed in/out of his breaks), was very productive against top competition, seems to be a very instinctual player.

If Egbuka were somehow the 8th WR drafted and we had a chance to make him that guy, I'd sprint to the board to get it done. The idea of him and Rice as the long-term foundation of the WR corps is extremely exciting to me. Then you can have Toney as a 3rd guy who gives you whatever you get from him (and of course, McMillan).

Yeah, I like Egbuka a lot. He reminds me of Jeremy Maclin. I'd far prefer him to Legette.

I think Legette will run a better 40, though. Low 4.3s compared to a 4.4 showing from Egbuka. He's big, but his deep speed is what makes Legette intriguing.

O.city · 12-14-2023, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Yeah, that's kinda where I am as well.

That said, if the 8th 'best' WR prospect is the 5th best fit on our board and we don't think a true year 1 player is going to be there for us in the 2nd, I can live with that kind of move.

(Especially if they go get McMillan for me in the 2nd)

Trade it for Aiyuk.

He then comes here and becomes the true free bird he's supposed to and is Jerry Rice 2.0

O.city · 12-14-2023, 09:27 AM

They've had this year with Mahomes being so frustrated about guys not lining up right and route running etc and you think they're just gonna throw another rookie and a 2nd year Rice and this group back out there?

10-10-2023, 08:45 PM
Couch-Potato MVP Couch-Potato's Avatar Join Date: Jan 2015	2024 WR Class Some interesting WRs in the upcoming class, who do you like? 1st - 2nd RD WR Targets: Keon Coleman, FSU, 6-4, 215, 4.6 Emeka Egbuka, OH ST, 6-1, 205, 4.3 Adonai Mitchell, TX, 6-4, 195, 4.5 Troy Franklin, ORG, 6-3, 185, 4.41 Xavier Legette, SC, 6-1, 225, 4.29 Brian Thomas, LSU, 6-4, 205, 4.35 Xavier Worthy, TX, 6-1, 175, 4.22 Ja'Lynn Polk, WAS, 6-2, 205, 4.48 Johnny Wilson, FSU, 6-7, 235, 4.42 Branden Rice, USC, 6-3, 210, 4.38 Malachi Corley, WKU, 5-11, 200, 4.46 Jermain Burton, BAMA, 6-0, 195, 4.31 This entire* class is tall WTF? Last edited by Couch-Potato; 03-24-2024 at 01:08 PM..
Posts: 6,256

12-13-2023, 08:19 PM	#304
Stryker In Mahomes I trust! Stryker's Avatar Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Baton Rouge, LA	ESPN Matt Miller 1st round mock: 1. Chicago Bears (via 1-12 CAR) Caleb Williams, QB, USC The Bears have a tough decision to make at quarterback given how well Justin Fields has played since his return from a right thumb injury a month ago. But he has been inconsistent over three seasons, and Chicago would likely take a quarterback if it lands one of the top two selections in the draft. Williams being available makes it an easier call, too. Williams is a big play waiting to happen, with 41 total touchdowns in 2023. His game combines great arm strength, mobility, poise and field vision to make him the best overall prospect in the class and a quarterback the Bears simply cannot afford to pass on for another year of Fields. Restarting the clock at the position -- both in terms of salary and development timeline -- now is crucial with Fields' fifth-year option decision on deck. 2. New England Patriots (3-10) Drake Maye, QB, North Carolina Much like Chicago, the Patriots need to start over at quarterback, especially because the entire organization could reset this offseason. Mac Jones' fifth-year option decision is also coming this offseason, and after he was benched for Bailey Zappe, all signs point toward a new QB1 in New England for 2024. Maye is a powerful thrower at 6-foot-4 and 230 pounds, with the arm talent to stretch the field vertically and the mobility to threaten on the ground. There are times his ball placement can be inconsistent, but his supporting cast at North Carolina did him few favors there. Maye -- who is declaring for the draft -- has the traits of a true franchise quarterback. 3. Arizona Cardinals (3-10) Marvin Harrison Jr., WR, Ohio State I believe the Cardinals will make the right decision here to build around quarterback Kyler Murray and draft an elite receiver prospect to be his running mate, rather than make a change under center. Murray has played well since returning from a torn ACL, and the Cards have receivers Marquise Brown and Greg Dortch both on expiring deals. Harrison is a magician at 6-foot-4 with fantastic body control and the fastest hands of any receiver in the draft class. He has the smooth and effortless route running ability -- plus the top-tier body control -- to quickly become one of the best players at the position in the NFL. He'd be the 10th receiver to ever get picked this high, per ESPN Stats & Information research. 4. New York Giants (5-8) Jayden Daniels, QB, LSU Is this too early for Daniels, even after his brilliant Heisman-winning 2023 season? Maybe, but teams will overdraft at quarterback in an effort to find the right player, and Daniels' dual-threat ability and vertical passing traits are very intriguing. His 50 total touchdowns this season make him a first-round candidate, but it's Daniels' improvement in the pocket and the best deep ball in college football that will truly turn heads come draft time. The Giants are invested financially in Daniel Jones, but his play simply hasn't been good enough, and New York can move on via a trade. His 38.4 QBR ranks 25th in the NFL, and his season is over with a torn ACL. Daniels' 95.7, meanwhile, leads the FBS. And sure, undrafted rookie Tommy DeVito has been a fun story, leading the Giants to three straight wins. But his QBR on the season? It's even worse than Jones' at 26.2. play 1:25 Where does Mel Kiper Jr. have Jayden Daniels on his big board?Mel Kiper Jr. explains how Jayden Daniels rose from a midround pick to number eight overall on his big board. 5. Washington Commanders (4-9) Olumuyiwa Fashanu, OT, Penn State First-year starting quarterback Sam Howell has likely shown enough bright spots for the Commanders to build around him for at least one more season. But they can't keep this current offensive line intact with Howell on track to set the single-season sacks taken record (58 in 13 games). Fashanu is a smooth-moving left tackle who has allowed one sack all season at Penn State. The 20-year-old junior is still developing, but he has Laremy Tunsil-like potential. 6. Tennessee Titans (5-8) Dallas Turner, EDGE, Alabama An offensive playmaker is very much in play for the Titans here, but this is a team without a double-digit sack player on the current roster. Outside linebackers Harold Landry III (8.5) and Arden Key (5.0) are talented, but the chance to get the best defensive player in the entire draft should excite Tennessee. The Titans have many needs at premium positions, so the best player available approach makes sense, and they can then find a pass-catcher or left tackle on Day 2. Turner has nine sacks this season. 7. Las Vegas Raiders (5-8) J.J. McCarthy, QB, Michigan Could the Raiders roll with Aidan O'Connell in 2024? Sure, but all signs right now point to them starting over at quarterback with a new regime in place, even after signing Jimmy Garoppolo in the 2023 offseason. McCarthy is instinctive, efficient and effective as a second-effort creator outside of the pocket. The Michigan scheme does him no favors in terms of statistics, but NFL scouts continue to tell me that McCarthy will be drafted earlier than expected. With Shedeur Sanders (Colorado) and Quinn Ewers (Texas) expected to return to college for the 2024 season, McCarthy is the lone first-round-caliber passer remaining on my board. And if things play out this way, this would be the quickest that four QBs have come off the board in the common draft era (since 1967), per ESPN Stats & Information. 8. Chicago Bears (5-8) Malik Nabers, WR, LSU The Bears have receiver DJ Moore and tight end Cole Kmet, but with Darnell Mooney struggling to develop into a consistent threat and set to hit free agency, they could stand to add more options -- especially if they are taking a rookie quarterback in Williams at No. 1. Nabers is the most explosive after-the-catch receiver in the draft -- he averages 6.8 yards after the catch per reception -- and I like to compare him to Stefon Diggs. You might wonder about a left tackle here, but I'm a believer in second-year player Braxton Jones, so Chicago would be wise to go receiver at No. 8. EDITOR'S PICKS Welcome to NFL draft season: 30 questions on QBs, standout prospects, intriguing teams 8dMel Kiper Jr., +3 More Rankings for the 2024 NFL draft: Top prospects at every position from Kiper, Miller, Reid and Yates 12dMel Kiper Jr., +3 More Kiper: How Heisman Trophy winner Jayden Daniels projects to the NFL 4dMel Kiper Jr. 9. New York Jets (5-8) Joe Alt, OT, Notre Dame The Jets appear to be all-in on the return of Aaron Rodgers, fixing what ails them most in 2024. But if that's the case, a major upgrade is needed along the offensive line. New York has allowed 55 sacks, third most in the NFL, and Zach Wilson & Co. have been pressured at the fifth-highest rate (36%). Alt is a pro-ready starter on the left side with one sack allowed all season. Given the turnstile that has been the Jets' left tackle position, upgrading via the early portion of the first round feels like a must after missing out on the top offensive tackles in the 2023 draft. 10. Los Angeles Chargers (5-8) Brock Bowers, TE, Georgia Bowers is my No. 6 overall player, but I couldn't find a value/need fit for him earlier than No. 10. Los Angeles wouldn't complain. The Chargers could luck out and get an awesome middle-of-the-field target who has similarities to George Kittle as a route runner, pass-catcher and after-the-catch playmaker. Bowers has 26 receiving touchdowns in the past three seasons and would immediately give quarterback Justin Herbert a chain-mover. 11. Atlanta Falcons (6-7) Terrion Arnold, CB, Alabama The Falcons miss out on the top quarterbacks here and instead look to bolster the defense with my CB1. Arnold, a 6-foot-2 redshirt sophomore, has five interceptions in 2023 while showing a physicality rarely seen from young cornerbacks in the run game. He's long and aggressive, and he has the ball skills to be a star opposite A.J. Terrell. 12. Seattle Seahawks (6-7) Jared Verse, EDGE, Florida State A powerful pass-rusher who can set the edge against the run is exactly what Seattle needs in a draft class weak at defensive tackle (another potential hole for the Seahawks). Verse can bounce inside or outside opponent offensive tackles at 260 pounds, and he plays very similar to Trey Hendrickson. Verse -- who transferred from Albany before the 2022 season -- has been on a hot streak and has nine sacks through the end of the regular season, showing he is getting better with more reps and experience. 13. New Orleans Saints (6-7) Keon Coleman, WR, Florida State A quarterback of the future would be lovely here -- Derek Carr has 13 touchdown passes to seven interceptions this season -- but the value simply isn't there. Instead, the Saints can get a top-flight running mate for Chris Olave. Coleman is a 6-foot-4 pass-catcher with enough explosive ability that FSU used him as its primary punt returner. The former prep basketball star stands out with the ball in his hands and when attacking defenses on 50-50 balls. If New Orleans did want to add to the QB room, it could maybe look at Bo Nix (Oregon) or Michael Penix Jr. (Washington) as Day 2 options. 14. Pittsburgh Steelers (7-6) Rome Odunze, WR, Washington Diontae Johnson's contract expires at the end of 2024, so there's room for Pittsburgh to add a physical, downfield threat with elite after-the-catch ability to the depth chart. Odunze has been the WR1 at Washington for three seasons, catching 25 touchdowns in that time while proving himself to be one of the most physical wideouts in college football. The 6-foot-3, 215-pound Odunze could pair with George Pickens to form a duo that would rival Cincinnati's WR group in the AFC North. play 0:31 Rome Odunze makes big-time TD catch for WashingtonMichael Penix Jr. throws a 40-yard TD dime to Rome Odunze to give Washington the lead. 15. Los Angeles Rams (6-7) Tyler Guyton, OT, Oklahoma The Rams might have found a left tackle of the future with Alaric Jackson, but the right side has been an issue this season with Rob Havenstein manning the position. Guyton -- a raw but highly mobile blocker -- is my pick for who will be the position's biggest riser during the pre-draft process. The former defensive lineman is still learning to play offensive tackle, but his agility in space as a run-blocker is fantastic, and his length in pass protection is ideal for a rookie starter. 16. Indianapolis Colts (7-6) Kool-Aid McKinstry, CB, Alabama The Colts could be looking at wide receiver if free agent Michael Pittman Jr. isn't retained, but the front office will likely do all it can to keep him on the roster for young quarterback Anthony Richardson. Instead, the Colts could look to the defense, where the secondary has been plagued by injuries and poor play. McKinstry entered this season as my top-ranked cornerback and then broke up six passes over 13 games while allowing a 32.1% completion percentage (tied for 16th-best in the country). The 6-foot-1, 195-pounder hasn't recorded an interception this season but has quick feet in coverage and great length to lock down top wideouts. 17. Denver Broncos (7-6) Ennis Rakestraw Jr., CB, Missouri Denver has a set of budding stars in Pat Surtain II and Ja'Quan McMillian at corner, but since McMillian plays inside, it still needs an outside cover guy opposite Surtain. Rakestraw is long-armed at 6-foot and 188 pounds, and his technique, quickness and instincts are that of a starting NFL cornerback. Turn on the film from the LSU-Mizzou game back in October, and you'll see Rakestraw get challenged just one time all day by the LSU passing offense. 18. Cincinnati Bengals (7-6) Jer'Zhan Newton, DT, Illinois Free agency will be huge in truly determining the Bengals' draft needs; wide receivers Tee Higgins and Tyler Boyd are currently set to hit the open market. We're operating here under the belief that at least one will be back in 2024. If it plays out that way, the Bengals can bypass receiver in this spot and grab the best interior defender in the class. Newton is slightly undersized at 6-foot-2 and 295 pounds, but he has a devastating first step and has used it to accumulate 16.5 sacks and 92 pressures over the past three seasons. What to know for the 2024 NFL draft • Mocks: Top 10 debate \| Miller \| Reid • Ranks: Kiper \| Yates \| Miller \| Positions • 30 big questions » \| QB Hot Board » • Grades and reports » \| Order » \| More » 19. Tampa Bay Buccaneers (6-7) Xavier Worthy, WR, Texas Mike Evans is potentially hitting free agency in March, and even if the perennial 1,000-yard receiver returns, he will turn 31 years old in August. It's time for Tampa Bay to invest in a younger top-tier pass-catcher, at least as long as one of the top four quarterbacks doesn't slip to No. 19. Worthy is fast and elusive with big-play ability. He has scored 25 touchdowns for Texas during the past three seasons and is a blur with the ball in his hands. 20. Arizona Cardinals (via 7-6 HOU) Kalen King, CB, Penn State After adding Harrison at No. 3 to help boost the offense, I could see the Cardinals focusing on cornerback with their second first-rounder further down the board. King was rated higher by NFL scouts than former Penn State teammate Joey Porter Jr. (No. 33 in the 2023 draft), and while he isn't as physical as Porter, he has better timing and ball skills. The Cardinals' pass defense -- which is allowing 7.0 yards per pass attempt, 26th in the NFL -- would improve with the feisty 5-foot-11, 191-pounder lined up outside. King has three interceptions and 19 pass breakups over his career. 21. Green Bay Packers (6-7) JC Latham, OT, Alabama Since the Packers have a solid young offensive nucleus at quarterback, wide receiver and tight end, they can focus on the line in the draft. The Packers haven't added a non-QB player on offense in Round 1 since 2011 (Derek Sherrod), but they could use some protection for Jordan Love. Latham is a massive blocker on the right side at 6-foot-6 and 360 pounds, and he moves exceptionally well up to the second level and in space. He's powerful enough to handle NFL rushers, too, and has allowed just two sacks in his three years at Alabama. 22. Minnesota Vikings (7-6) Nate Wiggins, CB, Clemson The Vikings are desperate for a franchise quarterback but probably won't be picking high enough to get a top passer in this class. Maybe they bring back Kirk Cousins? Maybe they sign someone else or address it further down the board? Either way, I like them adding a top-flight cornerback here at No. 22 if QB isn't an option. People at Clemson say Wiggins is the fastest player on the Tigers' roster, and he does it at 6-foot-2. He played his best football down the stretch of the 2023 regular season before declaring for the draft and has true CB1 traits. 23. Buffalo Bills (7-6) Laiatu Latu, EDGE, UCLA The Bills need to add an explosive playmaker, whether it be on offense or defense. And in this projection, the draft's most productive pass-rusher is waiting for them at No. 23. Latu, who medically retired from football while at Washington and then transferred to UCLA in 2022, has posted 23.5 sacks over the past two seasons. Medicals will obviously be huge for his evaluation, but based on tape alone, Latu has top-10-pick upside. His game is similar to that of Jaelan Phillips, thanks to his size (6-foot-5, 265 pounds), length and first-step speed. 24. Houston Texans (via 8-5 CLE) Chop Robinson, EDGE, Penn State Will Anderson Jr., the Texans' No. 3 selection back in April, has been amazing as a rookie, but the Texans need a consistent playmaker opposite him. The 255-pound Robinson doesn't have the biggest build, but he is super explosive off the snap and used that quickness to grab 11.5 sacks over the past three seasons at Penn State before declaring for the draft. He isn't a run-down defender yet, but his ability to get to the quarterback will help Houston's defense immediately. The Texans rank 23rd in sack percentage, recording one on 6.1% of opponent dropbacks. 25. Jacksonville Jaguars (8-5) Xavier Legette, WR, South Carolina The Jaguars have speed (Christian Kirk) and precision (Calvin Ridley) at wideout but lack power. That's what Legette brings at 6-foot-3 and 227 pounds. The senior caught 73 passes for 1,255 yards and seven touchdowns while outmuscling defensive backs on breaking routes and with the ball in his hands. The Jaguars appear set on the offensive line and could maybe add a pass-rusher, but Legette is too good of a value to pass up here. 26. Detroit Lions (9-4) Brian Thomas Jr., WR, LSU The Lions drafted a running back (Jahmyr Gibbs) and linebacker (Jack Campbell) in Round 1 back in April, but let's get them back to adding premium positions with early picks with a talented wide receiver. Thomas can play opposite Amon-Ra St. Brown as a 6-foot-4 red-zone target. He has 60 catches -- with 15 scores -- while averaging 18 yards per reception this season, and he'd be a physical mismatch for Jared Goff and the offense. 27. Kansas City Chiefs (8-5) Adonai Mitchell, WR, Texas Another receiver? This makes it eight in Round 1, which would break the standing record of seven set in 2004. But this WR class is dominant, and the Chiefs obviously need one. The Chiefs lead the NFL in dropped passes (29), and go-to tight end Travis Kelce is in his age-34 season. It's time to upgrade the pass-catchers on the roster for Patrick Mahomes. Mitchell is a playmaker who moves the chains at 6-foot-4 and 200 pounds. He also has 10 touchdowns on 51 catches (just one drop) this season and consistently comes up big in crucial moments for the Longhorns. 28. Dallas Cowboys (10-3) JT Tuimoloau, EDGE, Ohio State There isn't a clear-cut need in Dallas right now. Maybe a WR2 makes sense, or maybe some more depth at cornerback, though this team looks pretty complete at the moment. But the potential to add another pass-rusher fits with how the Cowboys like to build their roster. Tuimoloau wasn't overly productive at Ohio State -- 10 sacks over three years -- but he plays his best in big games, including four career sacks against Penn State last season. He's a heavy-handed defensive end who also shows up against the run. Get your favorite live sports, stories and originals with ESPN+, Disney+ and Hulu. Upgrade to a Disney Bundle plan and start streaming something for everyone today! 29. Philadelphia Eagles (10-3) Kamari Lassiter, CB, Georgia A Georgia defender to the Eagles? We've seen it before! And it seems to work well for Philly. Lassiter isn't the front-seven playmaker that GM Howie Roseman loves to draft in Round 1, but the secondary could use major upgrades considering that Darius Slay and James Bradberry will both be at least 31 years old come Week 1 of next season. The Eagles took Kelee Ringo in Round 4 last April and signed Eli Ricks and Josh Jobe as undrafted free agents over the past two years, but it's time to invest in a premium prospect at the position. Lassiter has seven pass breakups this season and has allowed just nine receptions. 30. Miami Dolphins (9-4) Kingsley Suamataia, OT, BYU Do the Dolphins need a left tackle? Not yet -- but Terron Armstead turns 33 next July, and there is a potential out in his contract following the 2024 season. For a roster with very few immediate needs, Miami can draft ahead, prepping Suamataia to be the future at left tackle. The BYU senior is the most active, physical left tackle I've studied this year, but he's also really good in space in the run game and moves smoothly in pass protection. He'd be a great fit for the Dolphins' scheme. 31. Baltimore Ravens (10-3) Chris Braswell, EDGE, Alabama The Ravens are getting career-year production from Jadeveon Clowney at one edge position, but he's playing on a one-year deal. Flipping the talent on the edge of the defense is always a focal point for this front office, and Braswell is tailor-made for the Ravens' scheme at 6-foot-3 and 255 pounds. He has great power when setting the edge in the run game, and he has added eight sacks and 13 tackles for loss so far this season. Braswell would be the 13th prospect taken on the defensive side of the ball in this scenario -- we've only seen that few Day 1 defensive players 21 times in the common draft era, per ESPN Stats & Information. 32. San Francisco 49ers (10-3) Taliese Fuaga, OT, Oregon State The right side of the 49ers' offensive line has been a weakness this season in both run and passing situations, while right tackle Colton McKivitz has allowed nine sacks and has the team's worst pass block win rate (88%). Normally, San Francisco might not find a solid OT picking at No. 32, but this class is deep. In fact, this would be the fifth time in common draft era history that at least six offensive tackles were taken in Round 1, per ESPN Stats & Information. Fuaga is a powerful but agile run-blocker at 330 pounds, and since he already operates in a wide zone-running scheme at Oregon State, he would be a plug-and-play transition into the 49ers' offense. Cornerback is definitely a potential consideration here, too, but Fuaga is too nice of a scheme fit and too big of a positional need to go any other direction Should we stand pat and take Adonai Mitchell or trade up with the Texans and take Xavier Legette?
Posts: 6,017

12-13-2023, 09:59 PM	#305
DJ's left nut Sauntering Vaguely Downwards DJ's left nut's Avatar Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Columbia, Mo	Rakestraw in the 1st? Damn - I love the kid and I don't have him that high. I figured mid/late 2nd for him - mid 1st? Wow. I just don't see it. Honestly I'd take Abrams-Draine ahead of him. I almost wonder if Miller didn't get his Mizzou CBs confused.
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12-14-2023, 08:44 AM	#309
O.city In Search of a Life O.city's Avatar Join Date: Jul 2009	Don't take the 8th best WR prospect. Trade up or trade for someone.
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12-14-2023, 09:27 AM	#315
O.city In Search of a Life O.city's Avatar Join Date: Jul 2009	They've had this year with Mahomes being so frustrated about guys not lining up right and route running etc and you think they're just gonna throw another rookie and a 2nd year Rice and this group back out there?
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