Marcus Peters also had verbal altercation with assistant coach Sunday

[Tribal Warfare]

http://amp.kansascity.com/sports/nfl...mpression=true

Chiefs cornerback Marcus Peters’ frustration following the Chiefs’ 38-31 loss to the New York Jets didn’t end immediately after the game, it appears.

According to a report by NFL Network’s Mike Garafalo, Peters also had a verbal altercation with an assistant coach on the bus during the team’s ride to airport following the game. The assistant coach was not named.

The Star reported Thursday that Peters’ suspension was related to his decision to leave the field prematurely following the flag toss. The club viewed that as a team issue, as opposed to the penalty flag toss, which it deemed a league issue that Peters was ultimately fined $24,409 for on Friday.

The NFL Network report cited Peters’ decision to leave the field as a reason for the one-game suspension coach Andy Reid levied on him earlier this week, with the verbal altercation also being a contributing factor.




The Chiefs still had a little over two minutes left to tie the game, and Peters returned to the sideline –– albeit with no socks –– as the offense made its last-gasp attempt. But the drive stalled out, and the Chiefs lost for the sixth time in seven games.

Peters’ suspension means the Oakland native will miss the Chiefs’ showdown Sunday against his hometown Raiders. He was not allowed to practice this week and will forfeit a game check.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

Nahhhh, man. You kept saying he just wasn't good enough, citing his lack of forced turnovers.

"He isn't as good as Ed Reed or *Deron Cherry or *Albert Lewis."

* Those two were your personal faves.

Lewis was a CB, so you're incorrect in that comparison.

Let's imagine 2016, without $12 million or whatever it was going to Berry, or his huge contract extension last year, which averages $13 million, in which the Chiefs essentially won 10 games without him.

Do you really believe that the Chiefs wouldn't have won 12 in 2016 and 10 in 2017 had they put that $25 million (or whatever the number) into the D line, WR corp or secondary?

If so, how can you say that with a straight face?

[O.city]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Lewis was a CB, so you're incorrect in that comparison.

Let's imagine 2016, without $12 million or whatever it was going to Berry, or his huge contract extension last year, which averages $13 million, in which the Chiefs essentially won 10 games without him.

Do you really believe that the Chiefs wouldn't have won 12 in 2016 and 10 in 2017 had they put that $25 million (or whatever the number) into the D line, WR corp or secondary?

If so, how can you say that with a straight face?

Flip side is, do you think they would have won 2 more games with Berry playing?

[Kiimo]

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

And, yeah. Landry is slow as shit.

We've already got a slow possession receiver in Conley. Difference is Conley is 6'3", ran a 4.35 and had like a 44 inch vertical while Landry is 5'11, ran a 4.7 and had a 28 inch vertical.

HARD pass.

Your lack of awareness of what both Landry and Conley do is hilarious.

Conley is super fast and really bad about getting separation with crisp routes.

Landry is a machine at getting open and making catches in crowds when he's absolutely #1 in the defenses mind to try and prevent that very thing. Conley gets like 2 catches in a game maybe and one will be for big yards because he's a big streaker outside receiver. Landry is a slot who set the franchise record for catches twice in his first four years.

They could not be more dissimilar and would be a great combo with Hill taking the top off. We can't afford him but your hard pass is super ignorant.

[Mother****erJones]

Berry basically won the Atlanta game himself, and brought KC back with his pick six in Carolina while Alex was shitting the bed in Carolina.

[Iowanian]

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Over the next 3 years.....Peters would cost us:

2018: $3 million
2019: Fifth year option - Roughly $9 million (as of right now)
2020: Franchise tag - Roughly $14 million (as of right now)

Why the **** would we trade him before 2019?

I had decided to stay out of this, but I'm going to give an honest answer here.


Given his recent history of an attitude problem that resulted in a suspension, do you feel confident that #22 would give a maximum effort for the team on a year that he feels 15M under paid(2018 maybe) or if he was franchised tagged against his will?

My concern is that he'll go into a tantrum mode and will not help, but would hurt the locker room under that circumstance.

If the decision makers trust him under those conditions or choose to give him a new contract, fine. They know more than I do, but I don't think I'll ever be a fan of his in any way.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by Mother****erJones

Berry basically won the Atlanta game himself, and brought KC back with his pick six in Carolina while Alex was shitting the bed in Carolina.

That doesn’t mean that if the $13 million paid to Berry that year had been invested elsewhere (RB, S, Dline) that the Chiefs would have lost those games.

[JohnnyHammersticks]

Didn't want to start a new thread for this, hope no one minds me just dropping it here. Got this email from Pro Football Focus about "10 record-breaking rookies from the 2017 NFL season" Pretty damn eye-popping stats for Kareem Hunt in terms of elusiveness when compared to other rookies over the last 12 seasons.

3. Kareem Hunt, RB, Kansas City Chiefs

PFF Era Record Broken: Most missed tackles forced by a rookie running back

Hunt’s NFL career started in the worst way imaginable after he fumbled on his first professional carry, but from then on, he was near-flawless and he ended the year with an overall grade of 88.9, the third-highest grade among running backs. At the close of the campaign, Hunt’s 1,327 rushing yards were good enough to claim the league’s rushing title, while his 527 yards from breakaway runs (runs of 15-plus yards) were also good for first among players at the position. However, it was Hunt’s elusiveness that truly separated him from the pack. On the ground, he forced a colossal 61 missed tackles as a runner, 13 more than the next running back this year and four more than any other rookie running back in PFF history. Add in the 16 missed tackles that he forced as a receiver and you get a total of 77 missed tackles, nine more than any rookie running back has managed over the last 12 seasons.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/new...f778-191479837

[Kiimo]

Kareem Hunt runs a 4.7 40.


HARD pass.

[ThaVirus]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Lewis was a CB, so you're incorrect in that comparison.

Let's imagine 2016, without $12 million or whatever it was going to Berry, or his huge contract extension last year, which averages $13 million, in which the Chiefs essentially won 10 games without him.

Do you really believe that the Chiefs wouldn't have won 12 in 2016 and 10 in 2017 had they put that $25 million (or whatever the number) into the D line, WR corp or secondary?

If so, how can you say that with a straight face?

I just had some fun with the search function. Youre right: you didnt compare Berry to Lewis that I could find, though you have mentioned Lewis a few times.

Anyway, you were definitely on the "Berry is way overrated" train. Sorry for the mishmash quotes. They were just all pretty good discussions. It's funny to re-read them.

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

He did not play at an All Pro level.

3.5 tackles a game and 2 Int's in 16 games aren't stellar numbers.

It was an honorary nod due to the cancer.

Originally Posted by BossChief

3 forced fumbles and 8 picks for a 5 year vet.

Let's be objective here.

The guy hasn't lived up to expectations.

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

We've been over this too many times.

I've compared him to Earl Thomas, which is pretty dumb considering the stark contrast in the way the two are used. ET averaged something like 1.2 INT more PER SEASON than EB. Meanwhile, Berry is far more productive making plays behind the LOS in sacks and TFLs, plus he has 3 TDs in his career. That's making a hell of an impact.

I remember comparing stats for Kam Chancellor and TJ Ward as well, which makes way more sense given position and scheme and Berry has a better stat sheet than either.

Your argument of him not impacting W/L record is so paper thin it's incredible. You could literally make the same argument for DJ or Flowers. This is a team sport and each guy contributes.

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

He has been a top tier safety as well.

He's been voted as such by fans (who are idiots, I know), his peers, and coaches in the league.

He's been awarded All-Pro status.

Any "top safety" rankings prior to this season would have included EB in the top 5 at the very least.

That's elite, brother.

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Five sacks in five years is hardly game changing. As I pointed out earlier, he has 11 less INT's than Deron Cherry's first five years in the league.

The mere fact that the pass defense was rated #1 in the league without him means that his $8.3 million dollar salary can be better utilized on a different position.

He's not irreplaceable.

Originally Posted by Discuss Thrower

Going into this year his overall numbers in the secondary were comparable to Barry Church..

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

That's cool. Except Barry Church blows cocks and Berry doesn't..

A defender can make a hell of an impact without filling up the stat sheet. It's pretty simple for a QB to simply throw the ball away from a guy if he's doing his job.

Comparing Berry to Romey Woods. This one hurt!

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Eric Berry is more Jerome Woods than Deron Cherry.

I'll never understand the fascination with the guy.

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

He's overrated, period, especially by ChiefsPlanet.

Take a look at Deron Cherry's numbers. He destroys Berry and it isn't even close.

Again, he's more Jerome Woods, who was also a first rounder and Pro Bowler, than Cherry.

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Earl Thomas is a better safety than Woods and if the Chiefs could re-draft, I'd bet they'd take Thomas over Berry.



Pro Bowls are popularity contests. Deron Cherry was a complete player and a game changer. How many games have you watched in which Berry changed the outcome of the game?

Furthermore, the Chiefs just had their best season against the pass in two decades, yet Berry was mostly invisible and outplayed by Ron Parker.

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

Berry was complete as well. He was one of the best run stopping and pass rushing safeties in the league while also being, as I've highlighted earlier in this thread, very good in coverage. People just remember when he got abused by Gates and some others in his rookie season and latch onto those memories.

For God's sake, we had the guy playing CB in 2013. Dude played LB, FS, SS, and CB. He was a stud.

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

Alright, I found some stats on the 2013 season. Anyone that remembers that year, we damn near had Berry cover the other team's TE exclusively. Here are some of the big names and numbers they put up with Berry blanketing them:

Jason Witten: 8 targets 3 catches 12 yards 0 TDs

Brent Celek/Zach Ertz: 5 targets 2 catches 18 yards 0 TDs/1 target 1 catch 5 yards 0 TDs

Delanie Walker: 6 targets 4 catches 43 yards 0 TDs

Jordan Cameron: 4 targets 4 catches 81 yards

Scott Chandler: 9 targets 3 catches 26 yards 0 TDs

Julius Thomas: 5 targets 3 catches 43 yards 1 TD

Antonio Gates: 8 targets 3 catches 21 yards 0 TDs

Coby Fleener: 3 targets 2 catches 8 yards 0 TDs

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

Bro, check those stats I just posted.

He basically took every TE we faced off the field. He changed the complexion of those games without it showing up on his stat sheet. Not to mention the fact that he did that while adding 2 INT return TDs and 3.5 sacks. He changed a hell of a lot in games.

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

You've got to stop looking at the box scores for player contributions.

Harrison Smith, Kam Chancellor and Devin McCourty are three of the best safeties in the league. They combined for 4 INTs all of last season.

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

It's about impact, not "box scores".

As I mentioned earlier, Deron Cherry had 40 INT's his first six seasons.

Berry has 10.

Who made a bigger impact on the field?

Furthermore, if I have to choose between a stout, man-to-man CB, an above average (hovering near elite) DT or a Safety, Safety is third on the list.

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

I'm with you. $11 million dollars for a safety that rarely intercepts the ball or makes game changing plays is a waste of cap space.

I know it would be extremely unpopular with the fans but I'd let him play out the Franchise Tag and draft his replacement in 2017.

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

We've lined this guy up at SS, FS, CB, and LB- he's played well at each and every position- and somehow he just isn't good enough. Receives first-team All-Pro honors at SS and FS- he's no Ed Reed! For God's sake, one poster was talking about lining him up at LOLB to replace Houston down the stretch!

The concerns about a lack of INTs are overblown. Taking a look at the careers of each of the top safeties in the league today, none of them fare particularly well against Berry in that regard. Throwing out any season in which the player didn't play at least 10 games in a season, Earl Thomas averages 3.5 INTs a season. Kam Chancellor averages 1.7 INTs per season. Harrison Smith averages 3.3 INTs per season. Reshad Jones averages 2.5 INTs per season. Tyrann Mathieu and Devin Mccourty (who both play a shit ton of CB and are really not a good comparison) average 2.7 and 3 INTs per season respectively.

Eric Berry averages 2.5 INTs per season. What's the difference?

Just say putting $10+m into a safety position isn't the best use of resources, because trying to argue against the guy's ability is just asinine.

[ThaVirus]

I never took issue with you saying you didn't think that a safety wasn't worth the contract or that you'd prefer we spend that cap elsewhere. I only took issue with you saying he just wasn't that good because it clearly isn't true.

[Simply Red]

Originally Posted by Kiimosabi

Kareem Hunt runs a 4.7 40.


HARD pass.

[Coogs]

I do find it interesting that the defense in the game Peters did not play, the defense probably had their best game of the season.

52 less passing yards than the average per game for the 15 games in which Peters played.

52 less rushing yards as well.

Gave up 7 points less than the average.

And forced 3 turnovers.


The numbers for that one game were top 3 defensive numbers for the season.

While it was just 1 game, it is interesting.

[ThaVirus]

Originally Posted by Kiimosabi

Your lack of awareness of what both Landry and Conley do is hilarious.

Conley is super fast and really bad about getting separation with crisp routes.

Landry is a machine at getting open and making catches in crowds when he's absolutely #1 in the defenses mind to try and prevent that very thing. Conley gets like 2 catches in a game maybe and one will be for big yards because he's a big streaker outside receiver. Landry is a slot who set the franchise record for catches twice in his first four years.

They could not be more dissimilar and would be a great combo with Hill taking the top off. We can't afford him but your hard pass is super ignorant.

Oh, Lord. First it was Philip Gaines' mom and now I've found Jarvis Landry's girlfriend..

The dude averages 10 YPC. You want to trade picks and $16m of cap space for a guy who needs to catch 120 balls to crack 1,000 yards. You're a real ****ing genius.

I understand completely how differently they're used. Doesn't change the fact that they're both possession receivers. We've got the one who's bigger, stronger, faster and can jump higher at a fraction of the cost. And I'm honestly not convinced that Chris couldn't match the mighty Landry's 60 yards per game if we targeted him as frequently as the Fins do JL. Conley>Landry all ****ing day.

[ThaVirus]

Originally Posted by Coogs

I do find it interesting that the defense in the game Peters did not play, the defense probably had their best game of the season.

52 less passing yards than the average per game for the 15 games in which Peters played.

52 less rushing yards as well.

Gave up 7 points less than the average.

And forced 3 turnovers.


The numbers for that one game were top 3 defensive numbers for the season.

While it was just 1 game, it is interesting.

The sample size is too small. It's not interesting at all.

A team just doesn't simply get better while losing an All-Pro player. The Chiefs with Peters>>>>>the Chiefs without Peters.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

I never took issue with you saying you didn't think that a safety wasn't worth the contract or that you'd prefer we spend that cap elsewhere. I only took issue with you saying he just wasn't that good because it clearly isn't true.

Meh.

I'd have rather spent the $25 million given to Berry elsewhere.

At this point, he's held together by Super Glue and Duct Tape.

The Chiefs would be a better team had they invested it elsewhere.