***** All things Fitness *****

[penguinz]

FYI, weight gainer shakes are a waste of $. Almost all the extra nutrients just get shit out.

Three big keys to gaining healthy muscle mass.

1. Get your macros optimized.
2. Lift weights, with a plan not just showing up and doing whatever you feel like that day.
3. Sleep! Sleep is by far one of the most important PEDs.


I was 120lbs when graduating HS. 30+ years later I am just over 190lbs with a much lower bf% than HS.

Want to get to 200-210.

If you want to gain mass the only way is to eat to the level to support your goal weight. Force feeding when not hungry is one of the worst feelings.

One way to prevent this is to get 10-15 minutes of aerobic exercise after eating. No crazy effort. Enough to get heart rate up but also be able to have conversation without being out of breath.

This will help you digest so that you can be hungry at next meal plus it also helps control blood sugar spikes. If you had more sugar than you shuld have during the meal your body will use the excess blood sugar for energy vs converting and storing as fat.

[Bearcat]

I feel like muscle size/mass/physique is a poor goal for most people. Of course, it's most men's goal earlier in life when we're dumb and also want immediate results. This video is a great example... says he's gained 30 pounds of muscle, but just sitting there you can't really tell.

Spoiler!

It wasn't that long ago I started noticing filling out shirt sleeves and generally feeling like I've made really good progress from a physical standpoint... and that's 4.5 years in. Granted, there are obvious reasons it's taken a while... I've taken breaks and slowed down at times for mid-40s reasons, and besides protein intake I don't go out of my way to track intake, and I don't eat way above baseline. It hasn't been the perfect plan, but I don't think there's a timeline out there where I'm mass gaining either.

I think people online who say you can gain pounds of muscle for months on end as a n00b, and specifically someone like Jeff Nippard nonchalantly saying he gained 30 pounds of muscle in his first few years (not the same guy in the video above.. dude looked like Michelin Man from the waste up in his younger pics), are just setting people up for disappointment.

Building strength is a far better goal, IMO... you'll generally know workout to workout, or at worse for a while you'll know week to week whether you're progressing by adding a rep or adding a little weight, etc. As long as that's happening, you aren't failing.... and you aren't waiting months or years to see it in the mirror.

Nobody is going to spend 8 years with a goal of building strength before realizing they're doing something wrong or giving up all together... if you plateau for x number of workouts or weeks, you'll know to change things up.

[Chargem]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

I feel like muscle size/mass/physique is a poor goal for most people. Of course, it's most men's goal earlier in life when we're dumb and also want immediate results. This video is a great example... says he's gained 30 pounds of muscle, but just sitting there you can't really tell.

Spoiler!

It wasn't that long ago I started noticing filling out shirt sleeves and generally feeling like I've made really good progress from a physical standpoint... and that's 4.5 years in. Granted, there are obvious reasons it's taken a while... I've taken breaks and slowed down at times for mid-40s reasons, and besides protein intake I don't go out of my way to track intake, and I don't eat way above baseline. It hasn't been the perfect plan, but I don't think there's a timeline out there where I'm mass gaining either.

I think people online who say you can gain pounds of muscle for months on end as a n00b, and specifically someone like Jeff Nippard nonchalantly saying he gained 30 pounds of muscle in his first few years (not the same guy in the video above.. dude looked like Michelin Man from the waste up in his younger pics), are just setting people up for disappointment.

Building strength is a far better goal, IMO... you'll generally know workout to workout, or at worse for a while you'll know week to week whether you're progressing by adding a rep or adding a little weight, etc. As long as that's happening, you aren't failing.... and you aren't waiting months or years to see it in the mirror.

Nobody is going to spend 8 years with a goal of building strength before realizing they're doing something wrong or giving up all together... if you plateau for x number of workouts or weeks, you'll know to change things up.

Interesting post, I agree and I don't.

I do agree with you that strength is a better goal for most than mass/physique, but then I actually really respect Jeff Nippard, he is a bodybuilder but he also values strength etc infinitely more than the average youtube fitness bodybuilder type, he has strength specific programs and has been a powerlifter.

I also don't find the 30lbs of muscle claim that crazy, and he probably did most of that with strength training rather than bodybuilding. It may also be worth noting that both of Jeff's parents were competitive bodybuilders so its actually more his access to knowledge that gave him a headstart over the average gym newbie.

I got into the gym initially via discovering Starting Strength and 5x5, and people add a ridiculous amount of muscle in the first year or so with those programs all the time. Those that don't, assuming they actually follow the workout plan, either they start overweight and have no idea the ratio of fat loss to muscle gain when they succeed, or those who start out skinny generally don't eat enough to max out their potential gains and hit the kind of gains Jeff did.

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by Chargem

Interesting post, I agree and I don't.

I do agree with you that strength is a better goal for most than mass/physique, but then I actually really respect Jeff Nippard, he is a bodybuilder but he also values strength etc infinitely more than the average youtube fitness bodybuilder type, he has strength specific programs and has been a powerlifter.

I also don't find the 30lbs of muscle claim that crazy, and he probably did most of that with strength training rather than bodybuilding. It may also be worth noting that both of Jeff's parents were competitive bodybuilders so its actually more his access to knowledge that gave him a headstart over the average gym newbie.

I got into the gym initially via discovering Starting Strength and 5x5, and people add a ridiculous amount of muscle in the first year or so with those programs all the time. Those that don't, assuming they actually follow the workout plan, either they start overweight and have no idea the ratio of fat loss to muscle gain when they succeed, or those who start out skinny generally don't eat enough to max out their potential gains and hit the kind of gains Jeff did.

His channel was one of the first I followed and I still watch pretty much every video he releases... he has a ton of great information and he really tries to keep it real in terms of knowing not everyone is a powerlifter and results vary drastically, etc. He also does a really good job of detailing what to do with information... he doesn't just say "studies say lengthened partials are amazing, just do those!"... but he'll say how he mixes them into his routine or how you can mix them in.

This is the picture I'm referring to...




...that's the same video when he mentions his parents were body builders, so there's all kind of advantages with that in terms of a workout plan, nutrition, recovery, etc.... and then he's obviously genetically gifted on top of all that.

Could I have ever looked like that? Yeah, kind of doubt it.

Pretty much all of those guys are very quick to pose throughout their video and tell you how much they lift, etc; so it can be a weird mix of information. He had a great video about where you should be at certain stages of lifting for bench, deadlift, and squat... and then it's oddly mixed with "by the way, I bench 800 pounds".

I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with his approach or most others... they're first and foremost genetically gifted bodybuilders who figured it all out at a young age. Most of them are also personal trainers, so I think they gain a lot of perspective about the rest of us, plus through all of their studies and so forth.

Renaissance Periodization/Mike Israetel is someone I've followed more recently and I think he does a really great job or breaking a lot of it down even further to the everyday lifter... most of those guys do a great job of telling you what is optimal, what's the best exercise for a muscle group, etc; and Dr. Mike often takes it several steps further with all the variables that play a factor in results. He had a good one recently (that I may have posted here) where he details genetics from like 10 different angles and not just the "hard gainer" at 30k feet, and what 'average' really is, etc.

[Chargem]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

His channel was one of the first I followed and I still watch pretty much every video he releases... he has a ton of great information and he really tries to keep it real in terms of knowing not everyone is a powerlifter and results vary drastically, etc. He also does a really good job of detailing what to do with information... he doesn't just say "studies say lengthened partials are amazing, just do those!"... but he'll say how he mixes them into his routine or how you can mix them in.

This is the picture I'm referring to...




...that's the same video when he mentions his parents were body builders, so there's all kind of advantages with that in terms of a workout plan, nutrition, recovery, etc.... and then he's obviously genetically gifted on top of all that.

Could I have ever looked like that? Yeah, kind of doubt it.

Pretty much all of those guys are very quick to pose throughout their video and tell you how much they lift, etc; so it can be a weird mix of information. He had a great video about where you should be at certain stages of lifting for bench, deadlift, and squat... and then it's oddly mixed with "by the way, I bench 800 pounds".

I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with his approach or most others... they're first and foremost genetically gifted bodybuilders who figured it all out at a young age. Most of them are also personal trainers, so I think they gain a lot of perspective about the rest of us, plus through all of their studies and so forth.

Renaissance Periodization/Mike Israetel is someone I've followed more recently and I think he does a really great job or breaking a lot of it down even further to the everyday lifter... most of those guys do a great job of telling you what is optimal, what's the best exercise for a muscle group, etc; and Dr. Mike often takes it several steps further with all the variables that play a factor in results. He had a good one recently (that I may have posted here) where he details genetics from like 10 different angles and not just the "hard gainer" at 30k feet, and what 'average' really is, etc.

I actually discovered Dr Mike recently too and have been enjoying his videos a lot too, helped by the fact he is ****ing hilarious.

[penguinz]

Originally Posted by Chargem

Interesting post, I agree and I don't.

I do agree with you that strength is a better goal for most than mass/physique, but then I actually really respect Jeff Nippard, he is a bodybuilder but he also values strength etc infinitely more than the average youtube fitness bodybuilder type, he has strength specific programs and has been a powerlifter.

I also don't find the 30lbs of muscle claim that crazy, and he probably did most of that with strength training rather than bodybuilding. It may also be worth noting that both of Jeff's parents were competitive bodybuilders so its actually more his access to knowledge that gave him a headstart over the average gym newbie.

I got into the gym initially via discovering Starting Strength and 5x5, and people add a ridiculous amount of muscle in the first year or so with those programs all the time. Those that don't, assuming they actually follow the workout plan, either they start overweight and have no idea the ratio of fat loss to muscle gain when they succeed, or those who start out skinny generally don't eat enough to max out their potential gains and hit the kind of gains Jeff did.

Mass comes from hypertrophy training (bodybuilding) not from strength training. This is why the first block in a powerlifting or strongman program is a lot of hypertrohpy.

[BWillie]

Originally Posted by Chargem

Interesting post, I agree and I don't.

I do agree with you that strength is a better goal for most than mass/physique, but then I actually really respect Jeff Nippard, he is a bodybuilder but he also values strength etc infinitely more than the average youtube fitness bodybuilder type, he has strength specific programs and has been a powerlifter.

I also don't find the 30lbs of muscle claim that crazy, and he probably did most of that with strength training rather than bodybuilding. It may also be worth noting that both of Jeff's parents were competitive bodybuilders so its actually more his access to knowledge that gave him a headstart over the average gym newbie.

I got into the gym initially via discovering Starting Strength and 5x5, and people add a ridiculous amount of muscle in the first year or so with those programs all the time. Those that don't, assuming they actually follow the workout plan, either they start overweight and have no idea the ratio of fat loss to muscle gain when they succeed, or those who start out skinny generally don't eat enough to max out their potential gains and hit the kind of gains Jeff did.

Yes I did 5x5 training back when I weight trained. Would highly recommend for a hard gainer. It was the absolute best for me at putting on mass. Hypertrophy training did not work for me. But I acknowledge I must be a special case because most of the guys I knew trained like that were able to get quite big but when I did it I saw no mass gains. Lifting heavy with 5x5 with core work was everything for me to progress.