Just remember one thing. The refs can determine the outcome. Just like in some olympic events, the refs can be judgmental.

Yeah, we destroyed them for a quarter, they adjusted, and after that their defense had little trouble stifling our offense, in both games. Our pass catchers doing them favors was a common trend in both games as well. ****ing Hardman blew TDs in both games with his idiocy.

Wait, IIRC that was a very poor throw by Mahomes in the week 12 game.

I could be thinking of another play though.

I know.

Did you hear the interview with Dwight Smith?

Again, if it's rigged, why are you bumping this thread?

If it's rigged, then Andy did EXACTLY what he was told.

He's either a bad football coach or it's rigged.

It cannot be both.

I just watched it. Now I'm in a bad mood. **** you for suggesting it.

I haven't read the conversation since this thread got bumped. Nor do I freakin care to.

Here's what I know.

We got to this year's Super Bowl because of Andy Reid.

We WON last year's Super Bowl because of Andy Reid.

You can be frustrated with Andy Reid's decisions in this year's Super Bowl. And again, I'm not sure if anybody has been saying this because I didn't read what people bumped, but if anybody IS saying that Andy Reid is still a bad head coach because of gameday decisions, then they deserve some Adam Gase tard as their head coach.

After all, I heard Gase knew how to use timeouts! Well shit... why the hell are we even keeping Andy around? Sign that guy's ass up!

**** you andy is a great coach.

We had been doing that the ENTIRE season. Reid somehow sucks at clock management when KC LED THE LEAGUE IN THE FINAL 2 MINUTES IN POINTS SCORED AND FEWEST ALLOWED BEFORE THE HALF. It's a complete bullshit narrative and those calls to be aggressive helped us win a few games this year.

Well, it's just like htismaqe says : either Andy is a terrible coach...or the shit is rigged. And since we know that Andy is actually a very good coach...we know that he gave those points to the Bucs at the end of the half because he does what he's supposed to do...

Then it's rigged.

The first timeout was fine since it was 2nd and 10, the 2nd timeout was awful given it was 3rd and only 2. Richard Sherman said it best. Sherman said other than possible Aaron Rodgers, no one else other than Tom Brady he would want in 2 minute drill. Sherman said it was an idiotic decision or words like that.

If it was 3rd and 6 or more, I can see gambling but 3rd and 2 is just too hard to defend against a team that was averaging a ton of points since Kansas City last faced them. Brady and the Bucs had the run as a realistic option and could have passed short which they did or even surprised the Chiefs with a long ball like they did Green Bay before the half.

RabbleRouser I do not understand how you internally reconcile the idea that Andy Reid is a good coach, thus the game is rigged. You do realize, right, that if it's rigged, there's no such thing as a good coach? If the outcome is predetermined, and everyone is just fulfilling their role, and the desired person wins regardless of how "good" they are, then any and all "greatness" is a product of the entertainment complex elevating specific folks to further narratives.

In such a system, you can't have a "good" or "bad" coach or QB, you have what the entertainment complex produces. So in reality, it's either that it's rigged, therefore Reid is Neither Good nor Bad, or it's not predetermined, therefore he is EITHER good or bad. Your conclusion that he is in that scenario therefore bad, because of his "terrible decisions", reeks of a school of thought that uses monday morning quarterbacking to fit existing facts to predetermined conclusions and which lacks any predictive power of any kind.

If it's rigged, who wins next year? None of this "well of course so and so won" after the fact BS, right now, who wins next year? Everyone can put down money and earn 5.5x their investment at minimum, all you have to do is tell us who it makes sense for the NFL to push BEFORE it happens rather than After.

By the way, the reason Andy Reid appears to be a brilliant coach with terrible clock management skills is because he is indeed a brilliant coach with terrible clock management skills. The reason he retains his job is because no matter how shit of a job you think he does, he is 1,000,000x better than you would be at the same job, and happens to be better than any currently available replacement, or at least is presumed to be by those who control hiring decisions. Just saying.

The idea of players and coaches being in on any rigging of games is so ludicrous.

These guys' jobs and salaries depend on their performance. They aren't going to risk their livelihoods just to rig a game for ratings.

Someone please shoot Rabble-rouser in the face.


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That's simply not true though. After the first quarter Mahomes and co were still dicing up that defense and were inside the ten with the score 17-0 but then Pat fumbled. Then after that we scored another TD in the third quarter. Then in the fourth Mecole and Pat messed up a certain TD and then we got a field goal. After that we kept the ball for four minutes to ice the game. That's not "stifling" anything imo otherwise why didn't they get the ball back when they needed it?

This rigged stuff is such nonsense.

Surprised that Reid called those timeouts at the end of the half? You shouldn’t be. We knew Reid was going ultra-aggressive in these playoffs. Look back no further than the last drive in the Browns game. The guy calls 4 pass plays in a row with Chad Henne.

I found that sequence far more head-scratching than I did his timeouts at the end of the half trying to give the ball back to Mahomes. Yet because one worked and the other didn’t there’s some feeling that one was a mistake and the other was brilliance.

Tell that to Dwight Smith (link below - listen to what he has to say)

They do what their bosses tell them to do, just like anyone else with a job. The idea that you think they're somehow "risking their livelihood just to rig a game for ratings" is where YOU'RE being ludicrous - because that's what the NFL pays them to do in the first place

But don't take my word for it - listen to someone who's been there :

https://953wdae.iheart.com/alternate...mpression=true

I wasted 10 minutes of my life and listened to it. And it was every bit as worthless as I thought it would be.

So thousands of people have played in the NFL. Many of them fringe players who never made much of a living financially and were discarded when they got injured. Many of them who would have real animosity toward the sport. None of them allege anything like this.

But one random former player happens to say the game is rigged without a shred of real evidence and suddenly you’re convinced.

It’s not even worth going back and forth on this. I can maybe accept that the refs have an incentive to skew a game, but the idea that these games are scripted is so ludicrous. And anyone who truly believes that is a complete moron that can go storm Area 51 with BlackOp.

I understand being upset about the loss, how poorly the Chiefs o line played and a few questionable penalties which really came at the wrong time. It's understandable to want to come up with reasons for the poor performance.

To me, it's pretty simple: losing Fisher along with the other injuries on the offensive line really limited what the Chiefs were able to do, add the Britt Reid 'accident' and the lack of pressure the defensive line was putting on teams and it was clear to me early on that there was no way that the Chiefs were going to win.

And yes, it would have been a really bad look for the NFL if the Chiefs and Reid would have won after Britt Reid put a child in the hospital. That was, I believe, a factor that can't be ignored however it's not why they lost.

"We WON last year's Super Bowl because of Andy Reid." how the hell do you figure? Chiefs should have lost last year..if it wasn't a borderline miracle pass to Hill (and note, if it had been any other ref crew Fisher probably would have been called for holding) Reid ends up most likely losing 2 SB's in a row. Chiefs win in spite of Reid, not because of him. Mahomes is the reason we've been to two SB's in a row. Period.

SO much dumbassery here. Period.

If you think that pass was a miracle, you know shit about football.

Reid had been setting the niners up with that same formation all game.

Hill was going to be wide open. Mahomes knew it. All he needed was time to get it off, hence the 15 yard drop back, and the throw to THE SPOT he knew Hill was going to be.

Hill was so wide open he stopped and waited on it to catch it.

Reid has his flaws, certainly. But his ability to set up defenses and scheme guys open is extremely elite.

Relax. We'll win the SB again in the next couple years and everything will be peachy.

You think we're even getting to the Super Bowl with Todd ****ing Haley?

How about a coach whose dick everybody loooooves to suck for his in-game decisions-- Mike Vrabel. You really ****ing think Mike Vrabel and whatever Arthur Smith/Jimmy Raye/Paul Hackett asshole OC he hires gets Mahomes playing to the peak of his ability like this? You love Vrabel for his use of timeouts and "clock management" but aren't wise enough to see how the team isn't or wouldn't be as explosive as Andy Reid has them.

Speaking of which, let's go back to that "miracle pass" you're talking about. Who ****ing drew that shit up? Hmm? Who did it?

Yeah, get ****ed. Andy Reid was the perfect coach to get us to the promised land last year. We don't get there with Matt Nagy or any of Reid's cronies. We needed Andy Reid, and we got him. Thus, we got the ring.

See, and when I thought the Chiefs were going to break records in this most recent Super Bowl, it didn't occur to me that it would be a record number of penalties in a half...

Wasn't it an amazing coincidence how the Chiefs were always getting flagged for holding and DPI...and Tampa couldn't get a penalty, even when Suh punched Mahomes in the face?

Such amazing coincidences...

It's so WWE, Okafor should have powerbomed Brady on the next series and took him out of the game. Seriously.

If they were just gonna throw flags on us for phantom infractions, and NOT call Tampa for anything (which is what happened), we should've went all Longest Yard on that ass.

Because it was obviously not unbiased in the way the refs called that game. It was terribly one-sided.

Not sure about Reid being issue for losing or reason for winning.

Team was not executing and Reid and Bieniemy couldn't come up with something to get the Chiefs a TD.

Buccaneers (Bowles) had the answer for everything Chiefs did.

Stuff happens.
I accept the Bucs outplayed the Chiefs.
No more crying in your beer fellas.

Hopefully KC org is getting busy to do things that get KC ready for a repeat visit to SB.

Reminds me of what Dwight Smith said :

"We knew everything the Raiders were going to do. The outcome was predetermined...why do you think we had an answer for everything they did?"

It's those things that make ya go "yeah..."

You have to adjust to the situation and team though. Bucs showed against the Bucs what they can do at the end of the half. It was stupid to call TOs there.

Agreed.

If your aggressive MOJO is working then okay, BUT we did NOT have the MOJO and Andy got desperate and should have settled going into the locker room. This is what panic and distraction do to you. You lose perspective.

At what point did Suh punch Mahomes in the face?

If you are referring to the same play and consider that a "punch" that is laughable in the context of tackle football. Any quarterback who played not too long ago would consider that hit 2 hand touch compared to what happened previously in those situations. The quarterbacks were leveled if they exposed themselves like that in situations where defensive linemen could pickup speed. Suh appeared to be just trying to get Mahomes down with as little force as possible. Imagine Suh landing on Mahomes with full force/speed in that situation with I believe the game already over.

Okay for folks to bash Suh from some of his antics of the past. Some of the stuff he did at times with Detroit were cheap shots/dirty/maybe retaliation in some cases.

But I actually don't think Suh wants to be the one that seriously injures Mahomes needlessly.

They were both on the ground, Suh reached out and threw a hand right at Patrick's face. Patrick immediately turned toward the official with his arms outstretched like "what the HELL!? Where's the flag?" and the official just turned away...

You'd have to find the actual broadcast, I'm sure it's not on any of the "mic'ed up" highlight videos or anything...but it happened.

Come and try it yourself, pussy.

I remember the hit. It’s normally not called since both were sliding, but certainly could’ve been. By rule it was a foul

I also remember when Brady got a free 15 yards in the AFCCG when Chris Jones hit his shoulder. Laughable

Also interesting that you guys (with Steve Grogan) lost a playoff game 44 years ago to Oakland because one of your lineman hit Stabler in the head

He clearly hit Mahomes in the head, it was clearly a foul, and it was clearly not called.

And it was clearly in direct contrast to the 2018 AFCCG you referenced where Chris Jones tapped Brady on the shoulder and got a 15 yard flag for an illegal hit...

I'm sure the NFL has one of its "pulse of the fans" people reading these threads and they know that KC fans will be eager to be back next year and primed.

I hate the world we live in. I really, really do.

Wait until they need to influence things so Rogers needs to be a storyline.

****, you'd have thought they would've had Rodgers vs Mahomes this year. Tom Brady Super Bowls are as boring as watching old people ****.

Ok, but they also didn't convert the 3rd down without a completely phantom DPI.... stopping the conversion doesn't necessarily mean it was a wise choice, but they bet on their defense and the defense made the stop.

That's just not true though. And I don't mean in the sense of "if they interfered with them they didn't make the stop", I mean that in the sense of "none of this is accurate, that's completely revisionist history". The 3rd down play was to Gronk, it was a completed pass which was converted for a 1st down. The pass interference calls on that drive were on 1st and 10 and 1st and 9. You can argue those calls are not legitimate all you want, but them not occurring would NOT have resulted in a 4th down.

(As a side note, I know you won't agree with this at all and even if you rewatch the play will see it totally differently than I do, but a "phantom" DPI call would be one where there is no contact between the defender and the receiver, not one where the defender is playing the ball, stops playing the ball, dives forward, reaches out his arm, hits the receivers leg and by doing so trips him up. Just saying.)

Oops... I'm getting old, there were so many horrible calls in a short period of time, I forgot they made that 3rd and 2 all by themselves.

I did watch it several times right after it happened, and a few times in slow-mo, because after the first couple of horrible calls on the previous drive, I was in straight up denial that such a thing was happening.... I understand there was contact, but 1) the ball was probably uncatchable since it was 7 yards beyond where he got tripped up, so there's no DPI, and 2) it was incidental contact from tangling up feet, so there's no DPI.

Evans' foot hit Breeland's as they were both running and then his foot got caught under Breeland a bit as he was already falling down. There's no pass interference on that.

And there was only 24 seconds at that point, and still needed a DPI call where the ball hit the ****ing back wall, which was far worse than the first one.

So, even with converting the 3rd down, I don't think it's a bad strategy by Reid.... it took two horrible non-existent calls, and even if the first one was somehow DPI, they still had a good chance at holding them to 3 if it weren't for the far worse 2nd DPI.

Reid was probably thinking they could possibly score 10 points between two possessions and make it 17-16, or at worse kick a FG to start the 2nd half and be within one possession... that was mostly the point.

I was pretty upset when Reid called the first TO. You don’t challenge Brady that way. Both DPIs were bad calls imo. The 2nd was simply horrible. If neither are called best Bucs do is get a FG. If only one is called I still believe a FG is the likely scenario. Refs handed the Bucs between 11-14 points in the game. Game is close to the end without that. Worst SB officiating I’ve ever seen. Worst playoff officiating period and we have seen quite a bit.

So please bear in mind that I do not expect you to believe any of this. But I want to throw it out there for your consideration anyway.

1) Evans was tripped at the 23, the ball hit the dirt at the 19. Had he been standing, he's 6'5". His arms are 35" long and he has a 37" vertical. A ball can be up to 12' in the air and be catchable. Ignoring loss of momentum, the ball landed within 12' of him, so no. Were he not tripped, that ball is by no means uncatchable. It lands in frame on the slow mo. And when in doubt, the rule is not err on the side of probably uncatchable.

2) The tangling of the feet is indeed incidental contact, which is permissible when Either both players are playing the ball, or neither is playing the ball. So the tangling of the feet, totally fine. However, not all incidental contact is permissible. The rule is, "Incidental contact by an opponent’s hands, arms, or body when both players are competing for the ball, or neither player is looking for the ball." Once the feet were tangled, the defender looked forward, and as he tripped dove out, slapped Mike Evan's ass and thigh, and tripped him up by doing so. As he did so, he was not playing the ball, while Mike Evans was still looking for the ball. As such, it does not matter if that contact was incidental. It would still be impermissible contact and as such pass interference.

I can address the 2nd one as well if you like, but again I think there's little point. I don't even know if you have access to the video and can review my statements for accuracy. Would you agree that if the 1st ball was indeed well within Mike Evan's catch radius had he not been tripped, as I claim, and if the defender did indeed slap Mike Evan's ass and thigh as he was falling, while not playing the ball, while Mike Evans was still playing the ball, such incidental contact would be impermissible according to the rules?

Here you go. Your take is weak.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...-bowl-referee/

That link doesn't work for me, so I have no idea what you're trying to reference with it. Does that contain the video? If so cool, props, you can see for yourself if my claims are accurate. As to the 2nd part, is there a specific fact you dispute, or do you just disagree in general as I predicted?

It in post #18 of the Brady receiving 27 PI calls. It works there. I disagree, because Evans falls because he catches his toe, not because of the hands from Breeland.

That's not true though, his foot lands flat after that, the step he does not complete is the one with the leg that is slapped by Breeland. It doesn't really matter though, because the question is not "would he have tripped anyway" or "would he have caught the ball anyway", the question is "did impermissible contact occur. Unless you believe the diving ass slap was permissible, the answer to that is "yes", right? So the question then becomes "was the diving ass slap permissible", and regardless of whether you believe it is, can you at least acknowledge that someone might answer no to that, and call it accordingly, as such it was not a "phantom" call?

Um, incidental contact is not PI. Ever.

That's why it's ruled incidental contact.

:facepalm:

And it was a ****ing soccer plop by Evans..

I'm gonna tap out here. Not because I think you are right either, because I don't.

That's literally not the rules. Read the rules bro. Can't link them for you but already quoted the incidental part verbatim, and they can be freely accessed and read online. Only permissible when both players are playing the ball, or neither is looking for it, which was not the case during this contact.

Breeland was not playing the player, he was falling down. He didn't initiate contact before he fell so there's no way to say he wasn't playing the ball.

Do you Patriot apologists ever get tired of being douches?

And this is why generally speaking I don't dive into discussions of specific plays with folks who are likely to be biased. The goalposts just moved from "incidental contact is always permissible" to "he didn't initiate contact before he fell". Note the rules don't have a provision where incidental contact is permissible when both are playing, neither is looking for it, or one of them is falling, but whatever, I'll tap out here as well. When knowing and following the rules makes you a dousche, there's no productive conversation to be had.

I stand by what I said, and what you think is irrelevant. Mahomes is one of the only QB's that can make that throw. Again, it's Mahomes and not Reid on why they won last year's SB.

I didn't move the goalposts, I addressed your specific argument.

:rolleyes:

Well, there's obviously no point... you've clearly pinned me/us as Chiefs fan who can't be objective enough to call it as it is, and while we all have our biases, we aren't talking each other into the things we are or aren't seeing on those plays.

Evans tripped because he hit Breeland's leg in his stride while they were both looking back for the ball... that's all there is to it. He was already falling when Breeland reached out, whether that was intentional or to catch his fall. And then Evans continues falling down because his leg got caught under Breeland going to the ground. And I don't think Evans tracked that ball very well.... yeah, he can cover almost 10 yards in a second, but if you go to youtube, the ball drops within ~.25-.5 seconds after he's going down.... it would have been a helluva catch. That's why I said "probably" not catchable.

It was incidental contact initiated by Evans.... Evans can trip over his own feet, Breeland's feet, just fall down.... there was no contact initiated by Breeland to cause Evans to trip and they were both looking back for the ball at the time Evans tripped and caused them both to fall.

I've seen the replays and have slowed them down on youtube prior to today... I've never been above calling it as it is because it's completely out of my control.

I don't WANT the NFL to have such incompetent refs or to think there's conspiracy things going on or whatever... and it certainly doesn't bruise my pride or ego or whatever the reasons are people can't be objective about their team, because again, I have no control over it.

Teams get beat sometimes and even embarrassed, and the completely unacceptably horrible calls in that game were only one reason (granted, a huge reason).... and if you're looking for seemingly less bias when it comes to those calls, listen to Simms or any of the other national media guys who were calling it for what it was, too.

Outside of correcting my obvious error with the 3rd down play, the rest doesn't even really matter in terms of the original point.... Reid was trying to be aggressive and I thought it was a great strategy. You can call the first DPI completely legit as far as I'm concerned, and they still should have only gotten 3 out of that possession (but, I guess Evans could also have super human hops to come down with that pass in the end zone LMAO).

I wish you conspriacy theorists would stop blaming the refs. They weren't good but like I said even if they were Chiefs weren't winning that game with the way our oline was playing.

Chiefs lost to the better team that day. It sucks but it's reality it happens guys. Brady has lost SBs and plenty of playoff games, so has MJ and so was Grezkty, LeBron etc.

Chiefs aren't going to win SB every year just because we have Mahomes. Deal with it and stop your crying. Chiefs can learn from this and get better. We'll be back hell maybe next year. We already are the SB favorites.

It can be more than one thing... and it's almost always more than one thing.

Many people here have already said they probably lose that game anyway, despite the refs, including myself several times.

But, I don't know how anyone can look at those calls and say they didn't have an impact on a game that could have been within one possession at the beginning of the 2nd half..... yeah, they don't win that game 100 times out of 100 if they only score 9 points, but being within arms reach obviously changes everything downstream in the 2nd half.

I understand the years and years of people complaining about the refs after EVERY loss has made for a 'boy that cried wolf', so there's this knee jerk reaction to say "stop crying!!!"..... but, just because people cried wolf 10 times doesn't mean there wasn't actually a wolf on the 11th time.

Such a long post and all I could think is what the **** is an octopode? Who needs 8 podes? Seems excessive.

Exactly.

When 2 of the 5 studio hosts say at halftime that the game is being over-officiated, it's a problem. It's not the ONLY problem but it's still a problem.

i think we lost that game when Fisher went out against the Bills. Our o-line took a beating this year, between injuries and Dr. Larry opting out. Last year our injuries seemed to hit us beginning to middle of year, which boded well for us as our starters returned and the backups got some playing time. Not the case this year.

That's true but there are going to be games and there have been games the refs have sucked and it benefits the Chiefs. That's just how sports is. Gotta take good w the bad.

Main reason we lost was because of how bad our oline was. You can blame refs all you want but bad calls will happen almost every game. Refs are human too. How you think Raiders fans felt w tuck rule?

Chiefs need to focus on what they can control. Gotta get more depth w oline and tweak a few other areas. We'll be alright.

Yeah, the Chiefs need to focus on what they can control and improve, me complaining on the internet doesn't change that. :D

There are game-changing calls all the time, and the Rams/Saints non-call is arguably worse than anything in this SB.... except I've never seen the volume of calls go against one team that were so wrong. As much as it sucks to point to one play, we're talking about... 4 or 5, or maybe one or two more than that? It's far beyond any acceptable level of mistakes, IMO, and it sucks the NFL doesn't even acknowledge it, much less would do anything about it.

And despite today's complaining, I have compartmentalized it away as something that simply lowers my expectations for the NFL product. Their product mostly sucks already, given the watered down regular season and having so few teams and match-ups that are really worth watching.... so, I really look forward to the mid-late January games and the SB, and of course far more so now with Mahomes.

So, you say over the course of a lifetime Chiefs fan, you get these ~15-20 years where the Chiefs are hopefully always in those games, or at least most years.... and then you hope they can make it to say ~5-7 SBs (if not more), and maybe they make it to ~8-10+ AFCCGs.

So, over ~30 years of being a fan and maybe another 40 years, I'm hoping they're in ~15 very meaningful games, and maybe they win say 10 of those.

Over the course of 45-50 years.

And the NFL has refs who don't know the rules or are part of a conspiracy or whatever, that makes it look like the NFL is telling fans, **** you, not this year? Yeah, it sucks... and it did overshadow what looked like a great dog fight early on.

I've seen plenty of wolves.

Postseason only?
Marcus Allen "fumbled" while laying on his back, Wild Card NYE 1994
Tony Gonzalez "incomplete, out of bounds" January 1998, Divisional vs Dungver
Tony G "OPI" vs Indy, Jan 2004 Divisional
Colts defender "recovered" Alex Smith's fumble while oob, @Indy, Divisional Jan 2014
Triplette's "Forward Progress" vs Ten, Jan 2018

There's been plenty of "wolves", sir. We've all seen them. Some of us just convince ourselves that we didn't see a wolf...but we all saw it.

This isn't Rams vs Saints no way Chiefs were winning that game.

I mean I never got the feeling we were going to win that game. Did you think we would win it if refs called game different? Maybe I thought we could comeback a little because of our past but Brady isn't Watson or Tannehill or we weren't playing at home. I knew if we got down early it'd be hard to win. Brady knows how to win especially when he has a lead and is at home.

Then you add the way our oline was playing we are lucky the score wasn't worse than it was. Chiefs played like shit and Bucs were on fire on offense and defense...

I just can't understand why so many of you have a hard time admitting Bucs were the better team that day?

It is what it is. Like you said complain all you want it doesn't change what Chiefs need to do. I'm just saying main reason we lost was oline. Refs should be way down the list if there at all.

ROFL
LMAO

You are the rube that the NFL counts on as a fan.

The Chiefs set a SUPER BOWL RECORD for most penalties in a half.

That's how we got "outplayed". The refs weren't going to even let us in that game for a minute, because if you give Mahomes even a sliver of a chance, then he's going to take it.

Nope, that game was predetermined from the outset, and you can tell when you watch it.

I mean, the Bucs Oline was holding Jones, Clark, and Okafor all game. MUGGING them.

Where were THOSE flags?

Amazing, you say "refs should be way down the list", I say either you're a rube with a double-digit IQ or you're an NFL op sent here to spread disinformation.

And, yet, you post this in a dumb Andy Reid thread.

Regardless of the outcome of the 1st half, you do realize that in the 2nd half the only accepted penalty on KC at all was a false start on Hill, right? Also that teams have come back from worse spots in the Super Bowl than 21-6 at the half or even 28-9 at 7:41 to go in the 3rd. There was more than a sliver of a chance, but it was not taken. Not trying to rub salt in the wounds, but the one spreading false narratives here is you. If it really was just the refs holding the Chiefs back, there's no reason they couldn't or shouldn't have come back in the 2nd half.

There's really not "so many"... probably only a few, really.

I really do think those handful of calls overshadowed a great effort by the Bucs, both defensively for obvious reasons and offensively for some of the adjustments they made.

And even taking away all the calls, the Chiefs are still losing, they still have to score more than 9 points and get into the end zone... so, it's not a clear cut "don't make this call and the Chiefs win", by any means. (at the same time, who knows how many other calls happen if things play out differently... they were that freakin' bad)

They were shutout in the '18 AFCCG at halftime against Brady and had only scored 7 through 3 quarters... so even though the SB looked much more like a dog fight, it's not like their offense hasn't looked like night and day within the same game before, or against Brady.

I just would have liked to see more of a 'fair fight' so to speak and to see what would have happened had it been a one possession game even well into the 3rd quarter.

If those calls don't happen and it's potentially 10-6 going into halftime and 17-9 in the 3rd? Oh, I'm definitely believing the Chiefs can figure it out... 100%. They probably still lose, but I'm willing to bet those types of calls and watching how the first half ended has to be a little deflating for even the most experienced and resilient teams and perhaps had an impact on how they played in the 2nd half (except Mahomes, who's obviously a machine).

And outside of Mahomes, the team didn't deserve to win that night.... but, I think they still had a fighting chance to pull it out of their collective asses had it not been for the refs adding 11-14 points on the board.

Yeah, I watched that Super Bowl where Atlanta got jobbed for another "Tom Brady moment of greatness, brought to you by The Shield".

All that you mentioning it does at this point is prove how rigged the NFL is for Brady.

1. The point of this thread is now, as has always been, that if he's as great as everyone claims, then he's complicit in the cover-up and a great company man for the Shield. Not my fault you're too ****ing stupid to understand that.

2. The mods could've nuked this thread last year if they wanted to, I actually asked that it be done then. But it didn't happen...for whatever reason...and now, he we are, one year later, and this thread has become more relevant than ever...

The more things change, eh?

ROFL

Mahomes played like shit, too.

For Mahomes, I mean.

Lots of times, Tampa Dlinemen cut in on the edge, leaving those little openings that Patrick usually slips through for yardage...he left those all game, didn't take them.

One of them, was I think a third down and we were heading to Tampa's end zone, third down. Shotgun. WR came in motion from the left and Kelce was iso'ed 1-on-1 to the left of and squared in and was WIDE ****ING OPEN. Tampa Dline crushed our oline and Mahomes sprinted right...there was a moment where Mahomes could've either taken it and ran or flipped it to a wide open Kelce...but he just threw it out of bounds.

Mahomes looked like shit. Not playing-wise...his EYES. His FACE.

He looked tired...beaten already...his body language...there was a shot of him standing on the sidelines with Reid, and he looked like...look, I know this isn't accurate, it's just a comparison - he looked like someone who had been up all night. Like worried. Or doing drugs. Or studying to beat a team. Or worrying about some guy named Donkey Kong Suh.

And for real, all the drops and balls hitting dudes in the face aside...there were some missed checkdowns, there was...

That's not the PMII I've watched for 3 years.

Figured I'd get this fired up again.

Stupid to put the ball in CEH's hands....
Let the best player make plays....That is Pat.....

We were in control this whole ****ing game and Andy Reid chose to take the ball out of the hand of his playmakers on what should’ve been the winning drive. This loss was inexcusable.

LMAO

Did anyone have any doubt Mahomes was getting us that field goal?

It was stupid ****ing call, but I don’t blame Reid for that fumble.

Runs had not worked the entire 2nd half. Might as well take a damn knee.

Good lord whoever bumped this is a ****ing reerun what an embarrassment