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-   -   Movies and TV Christopher Nolan's 'Tenet' (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=323063)

DaneMcCloud 08-24-2020 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants (Post 15127735)
A lot of folks called Blade Runner 2049 a snooze fest too. I loved it and watched it twice in theaters. To each their own.

It took me about 5 viewings to get through it after I purchased digitally a few years ago.

Shoes 08-27-2020 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud (Post 15127851)
It took me about 5 viewings to get through it after I purchased digitally a few years ago.

I mean I'm not one to call someone an idiot just because their taste in movies sucks, but I'm afraid you're an idiot if you didn't like Bladerunner 2049.

That being said, anyone checking out Tenet in theaters this weekend?

Deberg_1990 08-27-2020 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shoes (Post 15133979)
I mean I'm not one to call someone an idiot just because their taste in movies sucks, but I'm afraid you're an idiot if you didn't like Bladerunner 2049.

That being said, anyone checking out Tenet in theaters this weekend?

I don’t think it opens until early next week in the US?

It’s only open overseas right now.

Shoes 08-27-2020 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15134112)
I don’t think it opens until early next week in the US?

It’s only open overseas right now.

Oh shit, I'm in Canada so the release date is today for us.

JD10367 08-27-2020 01:13 PM

Nolan's films are interesting but aside from the Batman films they're not exactly captivating. He's a very intellectual director and his films are slow odysseys that you just need to sort of zone out and take in ("Inception", "Interstellar", "Dunkirk"). They're good but they're not terribly enjoyable, if that makes sense. He doesn't make movies the way he thinks people want to see them; he makes them the way he'd want to see them if he was in the audience. So far it's worked but let's not hope he doesn't cross into Wachowski Brothers territory (I'm referring to the awful Matrix sequels, not going transgender... NTTAWWT, although Larry/Lana looks disturbingly like Elizabeth Banks and is confusing my masturbation sessions over her...).

Deberg_1990 08-27-2020 03:49 PM

Uh oh. People are complaining about Nolan’s sound mix again. Similar complaints about Dark Knight Rises, Dunkirk and Interstellar.

I remember Dunkirk being the absolute loudest movie Ive ever seen in a theater.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Tenet is relentlessly impressive, intensely spectacular and a dazzling mind ****. However...the sound mix is so overwhelmingly maximised that it&#39;s sometimes difficult to properly hear the dialogue, making an already complex plot unnecessarily more difficult to grasp. <a href="https://t.co/NDZ4QGFMCz">pic.twitter.com/NDZ4QGFMCz</a></p>&mdash; jimi fletcher (@mrjimifletcher) <a href="https://twitter.com/mrjimifletcher/status/1298682935416061954?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 26, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">There’s one thing about Tenet which is important to note. My friends &amp; I thought our cinema’s sound mix was too loud. I’ve found many others are having the same problem and it’s a problem of the film itself. Some of the dialogue can be really difficult to hear clearly.</p>&mdash; DANIEL (@dpatt0) <a href="https://twitter.com/dpatt0/status/1297073521273630721?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 22, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I’ve heard multiple people, from several different countries, state that Tenet’s sound mix is all over the place. Genuinely thought this was a theater issue, but I guess the mix is off, which is a real bummer and surprising?</p>&mdash; Carson�� (@thefilmcarson) <a href="https://twitter.com/thefilmcarson/status/1298693491313311745?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 26, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

JD10367 08-28-2020 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15134658)
Uh oh. People are complaining about Nolan’s sound mix again. Similar complaints about Dark Knight Rises, Dunkirk and Interstellar.

I remember Dunkirk being the absolute loudest movie Ive ever seen in a theater.

People are already predisposed to complaining about volume levels in an IMAX. But when we ran "TDK" and "TDKR" in IMAX, we got way more complaints about not only the volume level but also the unintelligible speech. Bane was almost undecipherable in the trailers for "TDKR", and we were pleased to see (or hear) in the actual film release that his dialogue was much cleaner and clearer (so you can imagine how bad it was at first). I think Nolan's problem is that since he naturally mixes his music and effects louder, if a theater isn't properly calibrated it's easy for those to overwhelm the dialogue.

siberian khatru 08-31-2020 06:45 PM

Saw it tonight in IMAX. I have no idea what happened in that movie (and I’m a huge Nolan fan). It was possibly the loudest movie I’ve ever seen, and I concur, I had trouble making out a lot of the dialogue.

Nice action sequences. I’m just gonna have to read plot analysis and rewatch on blu-ray.

Bowser 08-31-2020 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by siberian khatru (Post 15141058)
Saw it tonight in IMAX. I have no idea what happened in that movie (and I’m a huge Nolan fan). It was possibly the loudest movie I’ve ever seen, and I concur, I had trouble making out a lot of the dialogue.

Nice action sequences. I’m just gonna have to read plot analysis and rewatch on blu-ray.

Worth the theater experience and risking of the ear drums?

siberian khatru 08-31-2020 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 15141281)
Worth the theater experience and risking of the ear drums?

It reminded me of Sensurround in the 70s. Several times my chair was vibrating.

But like I said, dialogue is a problem. After the movie some guy in the lobby was complaining to an employee about it.

Deberg_1990 09-01-2020 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by siberian khatru (Post 15141301)
It reminded me of Sensurround in the 70s. Several times my chair was vibrating.

But like I said, dialogue is a problem. After the movie some guy in the lobby was complaining to an employee about it.

That’s disappointing. Not sure why Nolan has to mix it like that?

siberian khatru 09-01-2020 09:51 AM

This pretty much is how I feel. (There are NO spoilers in this piece.)

https://www.filmstories.co.uk/featur...ing-in-a-film/

Quote:

Tenet, and admitting you haven’t a clue what’s happening in a film

28th August 2020 | by Simon Brew | 102 Comments

As more and more people find the narrative of Christopher Nolan’s Tenet near-impossible to follow, a few words about admitting you haven’t a bloody clue what’s going on.

This article contains no plot spoilers for Tenet.

I’m one of those people who, as a rule, tends to assume that I’m the problem. That if there’s a bit in a film or television show that I’m struggling to wrap my head around, there’s some part of the storytelling circuit that I feel I’m not completing.

I felt it when I lost track of who half of the characters were in the latter seasons of Game Of Thrones, for instance. I got it when I reached the end of mother! and felt that, whilst it was clearly distinctive, I should have liked it more than I actually did. And I’ve felt it again coming out of watching Tenet, the latest box of puzzles from Christopher Nolan.

I should declare up front: I’m a huge Christopher Nolan fan, and as better people than me have pointed out, his films routinely treat the audience as intelligent. He’s always got the balance pretty much spot on for me too, in terms of measuring that intelligence in tandem with outright accessibility. The closest he’s perhaps come to blurring that I’d suggest comes at a certain point in Interstellar, but crucially, by the time he starts throwing a few particular moments into that film that I have no intention of spoiling in this article, he’d got the vast majority of the audience utterly bought in. There were crumbs laid as to what he was up to, and I was keen to go back and have another run at the film. I’m glad I did.


In the case of Tenet, it straight away goes without saying what a pleasure it is to see such an ambitious film on a huge screen, made within the studio system by a man who I’d argue has long dispensed of any kind of focus group. The sheer spectacle of Tenet is really something, and I was constantly engaged by the visuals of the film, and the ambition on the screen. Heck, it was nice to be in a cinema, and it’d be remiss not to acknowledge the novelty of a new big blockbuster release.


Here’s the problem, though: for large parts, I couldn’t tell you what was actually going on in the film. Even now, two days later when I’ve had time to think about it, I’d struggle. It feels a bit like I’ve failed an exam. Genuinely, it quickly got to the stage where I’d have been guessing if someone had paused the film and set a test on what I’d seen thus far.

Thinking as usual that it was me, when I left the cinema I asked the two other people who I’d gone with – both of whom have active brains in their heads – about certain points in the film, and they were perplexed too. Between us, we barely had a Scooby Doo what had been happening. For all three of us to walk out of a film like that had never happened before.


I should declare that I’d avoided all reviews and trailers going into the film, so genuinely hadn’t read a synopsis or seen a frame of footage of the movie when I took my seat. I may have been at a disadvantage for that. Some foreknowledge, I’ve concluded, wouldn’t have hurt.

Still, I caught up on the reviews when I got home, and for once, I didn’t feel like I was entirely the problem. Writers I like and respect had posted their reviews and there was a consensus forming that you just have to go with the spectacle and audacity of it all, and not to try to actually wrap your head around it.



The terrific Robbie Collin, for instance, penned a review at The Telegraph entitled “don’t try to understand it – just rewind and enjoy the ride”. He loved the ride too, awarding the film top marks. The New Scientist – and the folks there are much cleverer than me – describe the film as “time twisting fun that is head-spinningly hard to grasp”. Empire throws in the word “baffling” into its summary. My colleague, Charlotte Harrison, said that she enjoyed it and truly appreciated it, but noted there were “extended periods of time where you have absolutely no idea what is happening”.

In fact, it’s a struggle to find any review that doesn’t make mention of just what a narratively tricky film to follow it is. Even from the people who really love the movie.



I’m, thus, going to be that guy. I think if a film is baffling large numbers of people, that there’s a sporting chance there’s something not quite right with it.

Furthermore, I’d also like to posit this: if Christopher Nolan hadn’t made the film, who we know to be brilliant, would it be getting the benefit of the doubt that the movie’s woven narrative is receiving?

I’ve no intention of spoiling the plot of the film, and not just because I forgot to get an MSc before I went to see it. But I do think this: a film, somewhere along the line, has to give you some way in for it to fully work. Tenet, understandably, features necessary explain-y scenes, and there are moments of exposition fired at you. Unfortunately, also fired at you is a continual grumble for me where Nolan’s films are concerned: a lot of loud noise at the same time. It’s sometimes very difficult to hear the dialogue. That in the case of Tenet, explanations are played out against roaring water, or the ultra-loud score, or a character wearing a mask. The bottom line is I and many others are struggling to hear what’s being said. In doing so, the film is putting obstacles in the way of following what’s going on.

The counter argument, that Nolan has said before, is that it’s deliberate. That the busy soundscape is part of the effect. I’ve never bought that explanation – what’s wrong with wanting to hear dialogue? – but I did want to put the alternate point of view.



Anyway, those without perfect hearing – and mine isn’t bad – are already at a disadvantage (and I do think that’s a broader issue here). Yet what ultimately doesn’t help is that Tenet like my old maths teacher.

I won’t name her, but she was brilliant, fascinating and distinctive. Still, that didn’t stop her tearing off making notes on the board, explaining stuff, and not giving you moments to stop and ask questions. If you told her you were struggling to keep up, she’d say ‘nonsense’ with a big grin on her face, and promptly add another paragraph of bumph on top. And you’d go along with it because she was brilliant, before realising you’d barely taken anything in at the end of the lesson.

Tenet, in its defence, does have moments when the characters stop to do a summary of sorts. Yet – outside of an initial explanation near the start of the film – it just baffled me. There’s something for me about the writing of the film that didn’t quite connect. I assumed, as always, that I was the problem.



But reading the plethora of reviews, of comments, and of articles already from people struggling with the film, maybe I’m not. I’d suggest that a sizeable number of people will be hunting for a plot explainer within 24 hours of seeing the film, and that the website that manages the best breakdown of it all – not this one, as you can tell – will be Google’s best friend for the next month.

I know I’m supposed to join the ‘just go with it’ argument, and I really see it. But conversely, why is the film getting what seems like a free pass for being so confusing for so many people?



I don’t think, after some thought, that it’s an unreasonable expectation of an audience member to be given a sporting chance of being able to follow a film. Sure, I’m already seeing messages from many saying that they followed it perfectly well and didn’t see what the problem is. Brilliant. I’m genuinely glad it’s working for some people. And I accept that many followed Game Of Thrones with ease, and plenty champion mother!

Yet every single Christopher Nolan movie to this point has made me feel included, has sometimes stretched my brain a bit, but crucially he’s never made me feel that I needed briefing notes on the way in.



With Tenet, I think for the first time the balance is off, and by some distance. I’m reading pieces now that suggest you need a second viewing to understand it, and I’m all for that. I love a second viewing of a film where you spot more things, get a deeper understanding of the movie, and get to enjoy it even more. Going back to Interstellar, a second watch really enriched that film for me. But crucially, I never felt a second viewing was vital to simply get a handle on the actual plot of the film.

In the case of Tenet, I’m almost feeling obliged and pressured to watch the film twice, as if it’s homework. I didn’t walk out thinking I actively want to see it again, I walked out thinking I should do, to fill in the gaps that silly old me missed. And I don’t think that’s the way it should be. As the UK reviewer Dave Roper noted on Twitter, “I think there’s a difference between a film that’s rich enough that you get new things out of repeat viewings and one that defies comprehension unless you watch it over and over”.

Because I can’t get away from this point: right now, if you ask me – and I suspect many others – to explain just what went on in Tenet, without cheating, we’d fall short. Way short. If you asked the same people how many of them heard all the dialogue – and I did a straw poll online on this – I’d reckon most people didn’t, and felt it hurt their understanding of the film. And I think these are bigger problems than are being recognised.

I liked good chunks of Tenet. I will watch it again. I love what Nolan does, the fact that he can get the film through the studio system, and make features like this exist in the first place. I hope I come to love the film.

At the moment though, I’m frustrated with it
, fascinated as to the testing process for the movie (if there was one), and don’t believe the sizeable issues with it should be brushed aside.

Because as things stand, most people’s only chance of getting the most of out the movie’s narrative rest on the film getting a fairer fresh sound mix, and a print-off of the Wikipedia summary page being handed out by the exit. At the very least, the film surely needs to make an effort to meet you half-way in helping you wrap your heard around it.

Tenet, for me, doesn’t.

Shoes 09-01-2020 10:54 AM

There is not enough adderall in the world for me to take to understand what the **** is going on in Tenet.

KC_Connection 09-01-2020 11:18 AM

I think this will be aided by multiple rewatches over time (as I think most Nolan movies are), but I will say it was one of the most confusing and difficult to follow movies I've ever seen. I expect that will be the initial reaction from most on first watch. The experience as a viewer is akin to basically trying to solve a really difficult puzzle for 2.5 hours.

KC_Connection 09-01-2020 11:19 AM

I also didn't notice anything wrong with the sound but I was at a drive-in.

Discuss Thrower 09-01-2020 02:36 PM

Liked it a lot, but the sound mixing and the plot point requiring gas mask use made the dialog really hard to follow.

oliverwilson1987 09-02-2020 06:12 AM

Tenet
 
This movie amazed me! Very good game by robert pattison! Didn't even expect this from him! An interesting plot of the film! I advise everyone!:clap::clap:

JD10367 09-02-2020 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oliverwilson1987 (Post 15143554)
This movie amazed me! Very good game by robert pattison! Didn't even expect this from him! An interesting plot of the film! I advise everyone!:clap::clap:

**** off, Nolan, we’re not buying it. Just clean up your damn sound mix, troll!

Fish 09-02-2020 04:02 PM

Mixed feelings. It was entertaining and full of action sequences that were really impressive. But the plot was super confusing.

Spoiler!

DJJasonp 09-02-2020 04:28 PM

I read an interview with Nolan, and he claims the sound mix is his intent.

He said he likes scenes where music or sound effects can move the narrative along as much or more than the dialogue.

He went as far as saying that often the dialogue doesnt matter (I think that was directly referencing the studio asking for Bane's dialogue to be "fixed).

siberian khatru 09-03-2020 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish (Post 15144670)
Mixed feelings. It was entertaining and full of action sequences that were really impressive. But the plot was super confusing.

Spoiler!

Spoiler!

Fish 09-03-2020 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by siberian khatru (Post 15145448)
Spoiler!

That's an interesting idea, and sounds very Nolanish.

sully1983 09-04-2020 05:08 AM

Caught this yesterday and thought it was entertaining as hell (very confusing at times though but no biggie as its sci fi after all) . Also, had to have been one of the loudest films I've ever seen in theaters. Would recommend it to any fans of sci fi.

BigBeauford 09-05-2020 04:39 PM

He needs some help in post production. A lot of his movies feel very amateurish based on sound and editing. This was for sure a bottom tier nolan film that I might have liked only a little bit more than Dunkirk based on the awesome locales and cinematography. Otherwise it was a mess that I was mostly witnessesing and not absorbing. I have no desire to see it again to try and figure it out.

DaneMcCloud 09-05-2020 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15150259)
He needs some help in post production. A lot of his movies feel very amateurish based on sound and editing.

Nolan has final say over his films, so what you see and hear is exactly as he intended

Deberg_1990 09-05-2020 05:10 PM

I’d like to see Nolan go smaller scale again like Insomnia. A film I really liked.

He doesn’t need to go full scale audio/visual assault every time.

BigBeauford 09-05-2020 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud (Post 15150267)
Nolan has final say over his films, so what you see and hear is exactly as he intended

I get that and I even remarked to my brother as we walked out, that based on his last few films with poor sound mixing that this seems intentional. It's still a shit thing to witness, and really juxtaposes against the high budget feel.

BigBeauford 09-05-2020 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15150302)
I’d like to see Nolan go smaller scale again like Insomnia. A film I really liked.

He doesn’t need to go full scale audio/visual assault every time.

Memento is still his best film, and that has the budget of a college film school production.

Bowser 09-06-2020 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15150311)
Memento is still his best film, and that has the budget of a college film school production.

Dark Knight and Interstellar say hol' up now.

BigBeauford 09-06-2020 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15150302)
I’d like to see Nolan go smaller scale again like Insomnia. A film I really liked.

He doesn’t need to go full scale audio/visual assault every time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 15151418)
Dark Knight and Interstellar say hol' up now.

1. Memento
2. Interstellar
3. Dark Knight

mnchiefsguy 09-06-2020 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15151704)
1. Memento
2. Interstellar
3. Dark Knight

Inception is better than Interstellar. Dark Knight is a classic.

I don't believe he has made a bad film.

BigBeauford 09-06-2020 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy (Post 15151734)
Inception is better than Interstellar. Dark Knight is a classic.

I don't believe he has made a bad film.

Tenet isn't a bad film. Its also not a good film.

mnchiefsguy 09-06-2020 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15151777)
Tenet isn't a bad film. Its also not a good film.

It is a very good film. Seen it twice already and it stands up to multiple viewings. I can get why some people won't like it, but Nolan's universe has rules made to be bent, and his storytelling is top notch.

Deberg_1990 09-07-2020 02:58 PM

Just watched it. Kind of a mixed bag for me. I really liked the first half up until right after the freeway chase stuff. Then it just sort of lost me with all the inversion and time travel stuff. Then it got too long at the end, probably needed to be about 20 minutes shorter.

Nolan overindulged this time. Oh, and i cant say i agreed with the garbled dialogue stuff. Understand it was a artistic decision, but its frustrating for your audience for sure.

BigBeauford 09-07-2020 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15152687)
Just watched it. Kind of a mixed bag for me. I really liked the first half up until right after the freeway chase stuff. Then it just sort of lost me with all the inversion and time travel stuff. Then it got too long at the end, probably needed to be about 20 minutes shorter.

Nolan overindulged this time. Oh, and i cant say i agreed with the garbled dialogue stuff. Understand it was a artistic decision, but its frustrating for your audience for sure.

https://media1.tenor.com/images/8f16...itemid=9222847

KC_Connection 09-08-2020 12:12 AM

It's so interesting that I had no problem with the dialogue at a drive-in (through the car radio). Maybe it is the sound setting at the theaters that is the issue.

listopencil 09-08-2020 07:14 AM

Saw it. Got a big meh from me. I was expecting much more, I was expecting a much better movie. The time travel elements were kind of dumb. They were used as an excuse for special effects and to push a plot along that comes straight out of a cookie cutter spy movie, complete with cookie cutter spy movie characters. There were some interesting and fun parts to it. I wouldn't call it a bad movie. Just not really all that good of a movie either. It's forgettable.

Deberg_1990 09-08-2020 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 15153254)
It's so interesting that I had no problem with the dialogue at a drive-in (through the car radio). Maybe it is the sound setting at the theaters that is the issue.

Perhaps it depends what on the theater sound settings some. But not all? Your telling me you could make out every line during the sailboat scene? Or when soldiers were wearing masks?

Some of it was accent related? For instance John David Washington I could make out pretty well for most of his dialogue, but the British guys I had some problems with at times.

I saw this in a brand new theater with state of the art sound too. I will say that the bass was extremely heavy so it potentially can drown out dialogue.

Dane can probably explain some of the sound issues better.

Deberg_1990 09-08-2020 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by listopencil (Post 15153330)
Saw it. Got a big meh from me. I was expecting much more, I was expecting a much better movie. The time travel elements were kind of dumb. They were used as an excuse for special effects and to push a plot along that comes straight out of a cookie cutter spy movie, complete with cookie cutter spy movie characters. There were some interesting and fun parts to it. I wouldn't call it a bad movie. Just not really all that good of a movie either. It's forgettable.

Pretty much how I felt. It’s not boring, it’s entertaining....obviously extremely well crafted. Just hard to follow in the last hour or so.

The going backwards thing was kinda hokey I agree.

Feelings are very mixed right now. I’ll watch it again next year on HBOmax.

Deberg_1990 09-08-2020 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by siberian khatru (Post 15145448)
Spoiler!

Hahaha. This would be mind blowing if that’s what he intended.

JD10367 09-08-2020 01:43 PM

Slightly less confusing than I expected, slightly less muffled audio than I expected, but Nolan still deserves a punch in the balls.

BigBeauford 09-08-2020 03:04 PM

Someone else put this better than I could: Denis Villeneuve does the things I used to expect from a Nolan movie, but better. After his last two turds, Nolan movies are no longer must see for me.

Frazod 09-08-2020 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD10367 (Post 15153959)
Slightly less confusing than I expected, slightly less muffled audio than I expected, but Nolan still deserves a punch in the balls.

I've just learned to loathe Nolan. I swore after suffering through the odious Interstellar that I'd never watch another one of his movies. Then Dunkirk came out, and I figured what the hell, it's a war movie based on actual events, should be straightforward. But no, he had to time jump the events instead of telling a coherent, linear story. I know his fanboys think it's all brilliant and visionary. Whatever. I think it's just annoying.

He's made some great movies that I really liked, but at some point he became less concerned about making great movies and more concerned about the need to continually outsmart himself by making each movie more ridiculously and needlessly convoluted than the last. And now he's running shit backwards with muffled dialogue? Yeah, **** that.

comochiefsfan 09-08-2020 03:18 PM

Other than The Dark Knight, The Prestige is Nolan’s best film. By far imo.

listopencil 09-08-2020 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod (Post 15154143)
I've just learned to loathe Nolan. I swore after suffering through the odious Interstellar that I'd never watch another one of his movies. Then Dunkirk came out, and I figured what the hell, it's a war movie based on actual events, should be straightforward. But no, he had to time jump the events instead of telling a coherent, linear story. I know his fanboys think it's all brilliant and visionary. Whatever. I think it's just annoying.

He's made some great movies that I really liked, but at some point he became less concerned about making great movies and more concerned about the need to continually outsmart himself by making each movie more ridiculously and needlessly convoluted than the last. And now he's running shit backwards with muffled dialogue? Yeah, **** that.

I think he was skimming through old video in his editing room one day and saw something that he thought looked cool when he ran it backwards. Then he just thought, "That looks cool. I'm gonna make a movie about that." And that's all this is.

Frazod 09-08-2020 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by comochiefsfan (Post 15154157)
Other than The Dark Knight, The Prestige is Nolan’s best film. By far imo.

I still think Batman Begins is the best of the trilogy. It's the only one I'll still occasionally watch. I personally think that Dark Knight was when he started to go off the rails.

Prestige is awesome. I really liked Insomnia, too.

BigBeauford 09-08-2020 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod (Post 15154190)
I still think Batman Begins is the best of the trilogy. It's the only one I'll still occasionally watch. I personally think that Dark Knight was when he started to go off the rails.

Prestige is awesome. I really liked Insomnia, too.

If you haven't, do yourself a favor and watch "Memento". Its his best work IMO, and Guy Pierce is one of Hollywood's most underrated actors.

KC_Connection 09-08-2020 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15153336)
Perhaps it depends what on the theater sound settings some. But not all? Your telling me you could make out every line during the sailboat scene? Or when soldiers were wearing masks?

Some of it was accent related? For instance John David Washington I could make out pretty well for most of his dialogue, but the British guys I had some problems with at times.

I saw this in a brand new theater with state of the art sound too. I will say that the bass was extremely heavy so it potentially can drown out dialogue.

Dane can probably explain some of the sound issues better.

I could hear everything fine for the most part, yeah. Didn't make understanding the movie for most of it any easier, though.

Frazod 09-08-2020 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15154499)
If you haven't, do yourself a favor and watch "Memento". Its his best work IMO, and Guy Pierce is one of Hollywood's most underrated actors.

I've seen it. I liked it, just not as much as some of his other earlier stuff.

RN47 09-09-2020 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod (Post 15154143)
I've just learned to loathe Nolan. I swore after suffering through the odious Interstellar that I'd never watch another one of his movies. Then Dunkirk came out, and I figured what the hell, it's a war movie based on actual events, should be straightforward. But no, he had to time jump the events instead of telling a coherent, linear story. I know his fanboys think it's all brilliant and visionary. Whatever. I think it's just annoying.

He's made some great movies that I really liked, but at some point he became less concerned about making great movies and more concerned about the need to continually outsmart himself by making each movie more ridiculously and needlessly convoluted than the last. And now he's running shit backwards with muffled dialogue? Yeah, **** that.


Bringo.:thumb:

sully1983 09-09-2020 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15150302)
I’d like to see Nolan go smaller scale again like Insomnia. A film I really liked.

He doesn’t need to go full scale audio/visual assault every time.

Kinda agree at this point. While I enjoyed TENET, it'd be refreshing & cool if he went smaller scale these days.

Would love for him to make a modern day British gangster film.

BigBeauford 09-09-2020 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sully1983 (Post 15155218)
Kinda agree at this point. While I enjoyed TENET, it'd be refreshing & cool if he went smaller scale these days.

Would love for him to make a modern day British gangster film.

He can't write worth a shit, so this would probably suck. The best British gangster flicks are brilliantly written.

Deberg_1990 09-09-2020 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sully1983 (Post 15155218)
Kinda agree at this point. While I enjoyed TENET, it'd be refreshing & cool if he went smaller scale these days.

Would love for him to make a modern day British gangster film.

Its pretty obvious he desperately wants to make a Bond film.

except it would run in reverse or deal with time ****s in some manner.

JD10367 09-09-2020 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990 (Post 15155275)
Its pretty obvious he desperately wants to make a Bond film.

except it would run in reverse or deal with time ****s in some manner.

Daniel Craig goes back in time in a Delorean to stop Libyan terrorists, and on the way he saves Buckbeak the Hippogriff. But he’s wearing a Bane mask for the whole film so you can’t hear a word.

Discuss Thrower 09-09-2020 04:32 PM

/r/FanTheories material here, but **** reddit so I'mma post it here.

Nolan has a meta narrative with his recent films, particularly Inception, Interstellar and Tenet, signaled by the fact that those films themselves are conducive to meta-textuality themselves as well as that they plausibly exist within the same universe.

Inception spoiler:
Spoiler!


Interstellar spoiler:
Spoiler!


Tenet spoiler:
Spoiler!


Spoiler!

BWillie 09-13-2020 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frazod (Post 15154143)
I've just learned to loathe Nolan. I swore after suffering through the odious Interstellar that I'd never watch another one of his movies. Then Dunkirk came out, and I figured what the hell, it's a war movie based on actual events, should be straightforward. But no, he had to time jump the events instead of telling a coherent, linear story. I know his fanboys think it's all brilliant and visionary. Whatever. I think it's just annoying.

He's made some great movies that I really liked, but at some point he became less concerned about making great movies and more concerned about the need to continually outsmart himself by making each movie more ridiculously and needlessly convoluted than the last. And now he's running shit backwards with muffled dialogue? Yeah, **** that.

I'm with you on Dunkirk, but Interstellar was a great, great film. Which coincidentally was Nolans worst reviewed film on RT while Dunkirk (Along w TDK) was the highest on RT

-King- 12-02-2020 12:22 AM

Just finished it. I obviously have to read more on it to even come close to understanding what I watched but off my first watch.....it sucked. By far Nolan's worst movie. I don't think I've had a bad review of a Nolan movie until now. They may not be great, but they're never bad...until now.

BigBeauford 12-02-2020 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King- (Post 15364976)
Just finished it. I obviously have to read more on it to even come close to understanding what I watched but off my first watch.....it sucked. By far Nolan's worst movie. I don't think I've had a bad review of a Nolan movie until now. They may not be great, but they're never bad...until now.

Inb4 "nah bro, you just need to watch it 7 times with subtitles on and high quality headphones"! Nolan is hurdling at light speed towards M.Night levels of hackery between his shit sound mixing and convoluted plots. Tenet was such a dumpster fire of a movie.

-King- 12-02-2020 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15365157)
Inb4 "nah bro, you just need to watch it 7 times with subtitles on and high quality headphones"! Nolan is hurdling at light speed towards M.Night levels of hackery between his shit sound mixing and convoluted plots. Tenet was such a dumpster fire of a movie.

Nolan kind of lucked out that covid kept Tenet from being released normally and that only a fraction of the people who would have originally saw it actually ended up seeing it. His reputation would have taken a huge hit if it was a normal wide release with full theaters.

Deberg_1990 12-15-2020 05:57 PM

Out on VOD and Blue Ray today.

I’ll be turning on the subtitles next time I watch.

DaneMcCloud 12-15-2020 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King- (Post 15367475)
His reputation would have taken a huge hit if it was a normal wide release with full theaters.

LMAO

This is absurd. The movie grossed $360 million during a pandemic and now, it's available on DVD/Blu Ray and Digital. It won't be long before it's on HBO Max as well.

The distribution mechanism is irrelevant.

If it's a bad movie, it's a bad movie. A movie theater doesn't make a bad film better. And Nolan has built a huge following worldwide so there's no way that one film that doesn't live up to expectations is suddenly going to ruin his reputation as a filmmaker.

Again, your comments are absurd.

-King- 12-16-2020 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud (Post 15401133)
LMAO

This is absurd. The movie grossed $360 million during a pandemic and now, it's available on DVD/Blu Ray and Digital. It won't be long before it's on HBO Max as well.

The distribution mechanism is irrelevant.

If it's a bad movie, it's a bad movie. A movie theater doesn't make a bad film better. And Nolan has built a huge following worldwide so there's no way that one film that doesn't live up to expectations is suddenly going to ruin his reputation as a filmmaker.

Again, your comments are absurd.

His movies have been decreasing in revenue ever since he peaked with Dark Knight. I don't think this movie if released widely would have helped turn that around for this and his future releases. It was a thoroughly bad movie and from what I hear, much worse in theaters due to his horrible sound mixing, no subtitles and the fact you can't pause the movie to even try to figure out what the **** is even happening, much less why it's happening.

BigBeauford 12-16-2020 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King- (Post 15401719)
His movies have been decreasing in revenue ever since he peaked with Dark Knight. I don't think this movie if released widely would have helped turn that around for this and his future releases. It was a thoroughly bad movie and from what I hear, much worse in theaters due to his horrible sound mixing, no subtitles and the fact you can't pause the movie to even try to figure out what the **** is even happening, much less why it's happening.

It's almost a satire of Christopher Nolan crawling up his own ass.

DaneMcCloud 12-16-2020 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King- (Post 15401719)
His movies have been decreasing in revenue ever since he peaked with Dark Knight. I don't think this movie if released widely would have helped turn that around for this and his future releases.

LMAO

Again, this is absolutely absurd and you have zero understanding of the entertainment business.

Cheater5 12-16-2020 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -King- (Post 15364976)
Just finished it. I obviously have to read more on it to even come close to understanding what I watched but off my first watch.....it sucked. By far Nolan's worst movie. I don't think I've had a bad review of a Nolan movie until now. They may not be great, but they're never bad...until now.


This mirrors my experience. I got so bored I was falling asleep, and turned it off about 50-60 minutes into it-- and I wanted to like it. Maybe I'll go back and finish it, but I'll have to make it a conscious point of doing so. But likely not.

Deberg_1990 12-16-2020 11:12 AM

I liked it overall. But admit it’s one of Nolan’s weaker efforts.

I liked it a lot up until about an hour and a half in.

Once the car stuff chase started. Then it completely lost me. And the final battle just kinda had me bored.


At least it was spectacle assault if you saw it in theaters.

DaneMcCloud 12-16-2020 11:22 AM

It's pretty rare for a filmmaker of Nolan's stature to have a perfect record at the box office and with the audience.

Spielberg, Ridley Scott, Clint Eastwood and Orson Wells, just to name a few, have all made amazing films, but they've also made films that failed to connect with the audience and critics.

Their reputations were not "ruined" nor did they take "hit". Sometimes, it takes years or even a decade for people to "find" a film that had been discarded, only to become an all time classic years after the initial release.

Christopher Nolan and his reputation are going nowhere.

BigBeauford 12-16-2020 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud (Post 15401878)
It's pretty rare for a filmmaker of Nolan's stature to have a perfect record at the box office and with the audience.

Spielberg, Ridley Scott, Clint Eastwood and Orson Wells, just to name a few, have all made amazing films, but they've also made films that failed to connect with the audience and critics.

Their reputations were not "ruined" nor did they take "hit". Sometimes, it takes years or even a decade for people to "find" a film that had been discarded, only to become an all time classic years after the initial release.

Christopher Nolan and his reputation are going nowhere.

He's one more mediocre movie away from becoming M. Night. Especially if he does it for 3 consecutive movies.

Deberg_1990 12-16-2020 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15401920)
He's one more mediocre movie away from becoming M. Night. Especially if he does it for 3 consecutive movies.

M Night got knocked down. But he eventually came back.

DaneMcCloud 12-16-2020 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigBeauford (Post 15401920)
He's one more mediocre movie away from becoming M. Night. Especially if he does it for 3 consecutive movies.

Nolan's films have grossed more than $7 BILLION at the Box Office so he's allowed to have a few films that don't connect with an audience every now and then.

Everything isn't about revenue, it's about studios backing and associating with the best filmmakers of the day.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure that Warner Brothers and/or any studio would love to work with M. Night, especially considering his last movie cost $20 million to produce while generating $247 million at the box office.

That's an amazing ROI.

staylor26 12-16-2020 09:13 PM

Going to watch this for a 3rd time tonight.

Enjoyed it the first time, but I was very confused and had to watch a couple videos on YT. The 2nd time was MUCH better.

Like Dunkirk, it might be one of Nolan’s “worst”, but it’s still an 8/10 for me :shrug:

And comparing Christopher ****ing Nolan to M. Night is a ****ing joke :facepalm:

Molitoth 12-17-2020 03:13 PM

I'm glad I read this thread, as when attempting to watch it the first time both the wife and I looked at each other and thought "WTF is going on? Can you hear what anyone is saying?" -- We got about 20 minutes in and turned it off.

I thought I was watching a bad quality stream or something as the dialogue seemed very mumbled and hard to understand. (Looks like a common complaint).


Anyway, I will attempt to watch it again sometime when I can crank the volume and my ears aren't feeling so damn old.

Nolan has been my favorite over the past 2 decades as Batman, Momento, and Inception have been amazing.

noa 12-19-2020 04:38 PM

What the **** are people talking about in this thread? Dunkirk is a phenomenal movie, and the fact that it made more than half a billion dollars for a lesser known WWII story shows his clout. The dude is firmly cemented as a top critical and box office performer, and that’s not even remotely in jeopardy.

KC_Connection 12-19-2020 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by noa (Post 15407987)
What the **** are people talking about in this thread? Dunkirk is a phenomenal movie, and the fact that it made more than half a billion dollars for a lesser known WWII story shows his clout. The dude is firmly cemented as a top critical and box office performer, and that’s not even remotely in jeopardy.

Dunkirk might actually be his best movie which is saying a lot considering his filmography.

As far as Tenet, I still haven't come back to it for a second time yet. Will see if I enjoy it more on a rewatch.

BWillie 12-28-2020 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 15408273)
Dunkirk might actually be his best movie which is saying a lot considering his filmography.

As far as Tenet, I still haven't come back to it for a second time yet. Will see if I enjoy it more on a rewatch.

No way Dunkirk is his best movie but it was well done.

KC_Connection 12-28-2020 02:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 15428086)
No way Dunkirk is his best movie but it was well done.

I think it might be objectively. I’m partial to others though.

Buehler445 12-28-2020 02:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 15428159)
I think it might be objectively. I’m partial to others though.

I think if you knew nothing about Batman at all ever and watched The Dark Knight it’s probably still Nolan’s best work.

But Dunkirk is probably in the conversation

DaneMcCloud 12-28-2020 03:31 PM

I finally saw Tenet last night and really enjoyed it. I really didn't have any issues with the sound, although one of my kids had some difficulty hearing so I put on the captions about halfway through. I avoided spoilers and this thread because I wanted to see it as "fresh" as possible.

I didn't really find the story to be overly complicated. Nolan always leaves clues in his work as to where the story is going, so I just paid great attention to all of the details of the film, so the 3rd act wasn't a surprise at all for me, because I expected Nolan to once again, warp reality.

The visuals of the "Inverse" were pretty freaking cool, although I found some of the physics to be a bit odd but the moment I saw the truck driving backwards and the green car crash, I knew it was related to whatever reveal by the end of the film. I even thought it was the Protagonist who JDW was wrestling with early in the film and thought they must be the same characters because they knew each other's moves.

The casting was excellent and it was really cool to see Kenneth Branagh as a "bad guy", which like so many of Nolan's films, is really more of a "Point of View" than clear Black & White.

IMO, it was another phenomenal Nolan film and while it could be the start of a franchise, it could quickly become "generic", for lack of a better word, in the wrong hands.

Overall, I thought it was an really cool concept and I was really impressed with Robert Pattinson's performance. I haven't decided where it stands for me in terms of his overall body of work but it's definitely up there, with Inception being my definitive #1 Nolan film.

Discuss Thrower 12-28-2020 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud (Post 15429234)
I finally saw Tenet last night and really enjoyed it. I really didn't have any issues with the sound, although one of my kids had some difficulty hearing so I put on the captions about halfway through. I avoided spoilers and this thread because I wanted to see it as "fresh" as possible.

I didn't really find the story to be overly complicated. Nolan always leaves clues in his work as to where the story is going, so I just paid great attention to all of the details of the film, so the 3rd act wasn't a surprise at all for me, because I expected Nolan to once again, warp reality.

The visuals of the "Inverse" were pretty freaking cool, although I found some of the physics to be a bit odd but the moment I saw the truck driving backwards and the green car crash, I knew it was related to whatever reveal by the end of the film. I even thought it was the Protagonist who JDW was wrestling with early in the film and thought they must be the same characters because they knew each other's moves.

The casting was excellent and it was really cool to see Kenneth Branagh as a "bad guy", which like so many of Nolan's films, is really more of a "Point of View" than clear Black & White.

IMO, it was another phenomenal Nolan film and while it could be the start of a franchise, it could quickly become "generic", for lack of a better word, in the wrong hands.

Overall, I thought it was an really cool concept and I was really impressed with Robert Pattinson's performance. I haven't decided where it stands for me in terms of his overall body of work but it's definitely up there, with Inception being my definitive #1 Nolan film.

See Post #135

Bowser 12-29-2020 12:45 PM

Well, I'm basically locked in with the ice storm today, so maybe I'll fire this up.


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