...

**OnTheWarpath15** · 09-08-2018, 07:21 AM

Damn good read on the dismantling of the Seahawks and the rift between members of the defense and Russell Wilson.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/09/07/se...n-pete-carroll

An excerpt:

Quote:

The same players also cite much larger, more pertinent issues. Such as after the 2014 NFC Championship Game against the Packers, when Wilson was invited to the podium at the 50-yard-line after having thrown four interceptions in the game. The Seahawks had just pulled off a miracle comeback, with the defense limiting Aaron Rodgers to 178 passing yards and intercepting him twice. Multiple defensive players had gutted through injuries, and yet it was Wilson who received the most praise, and Wilson whom Carroll saluted in team meetings that next week as having saved the season. “That’s when guys really started to notice the lack of accountability,” says one former player. “Before that, if guys made mistakes or we lost games, guys took responsibility for it, for good or for bad. We started losing that.”

**wazu** · 09-08-2018, 07:24 AM

Bunch of guys worrying about who gets credit. Tells you all you need to know.

Rasputin · 09-08-2018, 07:25 AM

I like it when they show Pete Carroll vigorously chewing bubble gum on the sidelines. You know he is an intense HC.

**BigRedChief** · 09-08-2018, 07:29 AM

In all team sports, team chemistry and or lack of should be given more credit for a teams success or failure.

Just this year look at the STL Cardinals. Not bad but under performing. Get the players on the same page and winning increases above the talent level.This isn't new information but coaches and GM's consistently undervalue this part of a successful team.

I personally heard DT and Smith trash the offense in a public place many times. They were pissed.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 09-08-2018, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wazu

Bunch of guys worrying about who gets credit. Tells you all you need to know.

It's not always about being a glory hog, but wanting your work recognized and for everyone to be held equally accountable. Most people don't tolerate double standards well.

"When several players who spoke to SI said Carroll gathered his offensive and defensive leaders and told them they needed to protect Wilson, to treat him more gently than they would their other teammates." In contrast, that is exactly what Belichick does with Brady. He will rip him in practice/film study, saying things like, "A QB at Foxborough High could make that throw."

**notorious** · 09-08-2018, 07:57 AM

Carroll runs a loose locker room.

No surprise.

NWTF · 09-08-2018, 09:22 AM

Just a one time SB winner flash in the pan.

That play call on the goal line that LOST the SB to the Pats was the final straw. Had it succeeded and they won it probably wouldnt have mattered to most of them, but if most of the team really believed Carroll was trying to get Wilson the SB MVP by calling that play then this ending was inevitable. Theres really no getting over that when they dont like the guy (Wilson) to begin with.

Why Not? · 09-08-2018, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

In all team sports, team chemistry and or lack of should be given more credit for a teams success or failure.

This may have been the single best attribute of the '14-'15 Royals.

billyreynolds · 09-08-2018, 10:27 AM

The dynasty was blown on the Super Bowl play. If you look at the sidelines on that play, Richard Sherman and the others were giddy with excitement, a feeling of inevitability. That goes a long way when you are great, and things are going right. It was such a shocking play, as Ricardo Lockette lollygagged his way toward the endzone before getting blasted on the interception, that this shock torpedoed the franchise. That is tough to overcome.

The best part about it was that after the interception, Russell Wilson hardly looked defeated at all, like he didn't care. After the game, Russell Wilson said the worst part about it was that he "just hates to lose". The way he said it, while seemingly not being stunned by the defeat, was odd at best.

There are certain plays that end things. About fifteen years ago there was a play in basketball, where the Sacremento Kings, who were every bit as good as the Los Angeles Lakers, were playing the Lakers in the playoffs. Sacremento was up two in a playoff game, already up in the series 2 games to 1. Seconds left....Lakers down two and miss a shot. Vlade Divac for Sacramento gets hand on the rebound but tips it way out to the top of the key, where Robert Horry of the Lakers catches it and shoots quickly, draining a three pointer for the win at the buzzer. The Lakers went on to win the series, and the Lakers cemented their dynasty, while Sacramento never was the same.

Prison Bitch · 09-08-2018, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

In all team sports, team chemistry and or lack of should be given more credit for a teams success or failure.

Just this year look at the STL Cardinals. Not bad but under performing. Get the players on the same page and winning increases above the talent level.This isn't new information but coaches and GM's consistently undervalue this part of a successful team.

I personally heard DT and Smith trash the offense in a public place many times. They were pissed.

Yeah, just like the St Louis Cardinals

WhiteWhale · 09-08-2018, 11:34 AM

Eh. There's something else driving the dislike of Wilson. It's the same thing that drove so much anger from team-mates at McNabb.

I actually worry people will do it to Mahomes.

Black players tend to dislike light skinned black dudes who come from money and 'act white'. Same reason so many NBA guys hate Steph Curry. Nobody really talks publicly about it, but it's a thing.

Kaep had the same problem in his locker room, which is why he went full african revolutionary to get black cred.

I'm not saying it's the reason, but the resentment is there from the start.

Halfcan · 09-08-2018, 11:42 AM

**** the Seahags and their 2nd Loudest fans too!

**HemiEd** · 09-08-2018, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

In all team sports, team chemistry and or lack of should be given more credit for a teams success or failure.

Just this year look at the STL Cardinals. Not bad but under performing. Get the players on the same page and winning increases above the talent level.This isn't new information but coaches and GM's consistently undervalue this part of a successful team.

I personally heard DT and Smith trash the offense in a public place many times. They were pissed.

I think Marcus Peters was probably as about as bad for team chemistry is a guy could possibly get. He Gone!!!

I think we are going to be pleasantly surprised by the impact it makes.

Halfcan · 09-08-2018, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HemiEd

I think Marcus Peters was probably as about as bad for team chemistry is a guy could possibly get. He Gone!!!

I think we are going to be pleasantly surprised by the impact it makes.

So you are saying... a moody guy, that rides a bike on his own during the anthem, has screaming matches with his coaches, refuses to tackle, goes off-script on defense and wears full Black Panther gear in the locker room is bad for team chemistry?

Sounds like it would be hard to trade a guy like that.

Sassy Squatch · 09-08-2018, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HemiEd

I think Marcus Peters was probably as about as bad for team chemistry is a guy could possibly get. He Gone!!!

I think we are going to be pleasantly surprised by the impact it makes.

I think you and I have 2 different definitions for "pleasant", but sure.

09-08-2018, 07:24 AM	#2
wazu ... wazu's Avatar Join Date: May 2002 Location: Kansas City, MO	Bunch of guys worrying about who gets credit. Tells you all you need to know.
Posts: 27,764

09-08-2018, 07:25 AM	#3
Rasputin Tip of the hat LIV Champs Rasputin's Avatar Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: ks	I like it when they show Pete Carroll vigorously chewing bubble gum on the sidelines. You know he is an intense HC.
Posts: 54,962

09-08-2018, 07:29 AM	#4
BigRedChief Has a particular set of skills BigRedChief's Avatar Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: On the water	In all team sports, team chemistry and or lack of should be given more credit for a teams success or failure. Just this year look at the STL Cardinals. Not bad but under performing. Get the players on the same page and winning increases above the talent level.This isn't new information but coaches and GM's consistently undervalue this part of a successful team. I personally heard DT and Smith trash the offense in a public place many times. They were pissed.
Posts: 79,010

09-08-2018, 07:57 AM	#6
notorious Supporter notorious's Avatar Join Date: May 2005 Location: Who knows?	Carroll runs a loose locker room. No surprise.
Posts: 83,365

09-08-2018, 09:22 AM	#7
NWTF Veteran NWTF's Avatar Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: overland park	Just a one time SB winner flash in the pan. That play call on the goal line that LOST the SB to the Pats was the final straw. Had it succeeded and they won it probably wouldnt have mattered to most of them, but if most of the team really believed Carroll was trying to get Wilson the SB MVP by calling that play then this ending was inevitable. Theres really no getting over that when they dont like the guy (Wilson) to begin with.
Posts: 2,580

09-08-2018, 10:27 AM	#9
billyreynolds Banned Join Date: Sep 2018	The dynasty was blown on the Super Bowl play. If you look at the sidelines on that play, Richard Sherman and the others were giddy with excitement, a feeling of inevitability. That goes a long way when you are great, and things are going right. It was such a shocking play, as Ricardo Lockette lollygagged his way toward the endzone before getting blasted on the interception, that this shock torpedoed the franchise. That is tough to overcome. The best part about it was that after the interception, Russell Wilson hardly looked defeated at all, like he didn't care. After the game, Russell Wilson said the worst part about it was that he "just hates to lose". The way he said it, while seemingly not being stunned by the defeat, was odd at best. There are certain plays that end things. About fifteen years ago there was a play in basketball, where the Sacremento Kings, who were every bit as good as the Los Angeles Lakers, were playing the Lakers in the playoffs. Sacremento was up two in a playoff game, already up in the series 2 games to 1. Seconds left....Lakers down two and miss a shot. Vlade Divac for Sacramento gets hand on the rebound but tips it way out to the top of the key, where Robert Horry of the Lakers catches it and shoots quickly, draining a three pointer for the win at the buzzer. The Lakers went on to win the series, and the Lakers cemented their dynasty, while Sacramento never was the same.
Posts: 19

09-08-2018, 11:34 AM	#11
WhiteWhale Bring it on Ahab! WhiteWhale's Avatar Join Date: May 2011 Location: Doo-Dah	Eh. There's something else driving the dislike of Wilson. It's the same thing that drove so much anger from team-mates at McNabb. I actually worry people will do it to Mahomes. Black players tend to dislike light skinned black dudes who come from money and 'act white'. Same reason so many NBA guys hate Steph Curry. Nobody really talks publicly about it, but it's a thing. Kaep had the same problem in his locker room, which is why he went full african revolutionary to get black cred. I'm not saying it's the reason, but the resentment is there from the start.
Posts: 14,861

09-08-2018, 11:42 AM	#12
Halfcan In Search of a Life Halfcan's Avatar Join Date: Aug 2005	** the Seahags and their 2nd** Loudest fans too!
Posts: 43,200