Ball Joints and Upper Control Arm 2004 Ford F150

[SAUTO]

Originally Posted by kccrow

Control arms are kind of pricey and there's less stress on the upper joint than the lower. I, personally, wouldn't change the upper/control arm unless there is actually wear. They dont' tend to wear anywhere near as fast as the lowers. I'd have them check the control arm bushings as well though just to be sure. If all looks good, do just the lowers and maybe outer tie rod ends.

This post really makes no sense

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by SAUTO

This post really makes no sense

Feel free to correct it where I'm wrong, I have no quarrels with that. I'm not an expert, I just know in my experience it's extremely rare for uppers to wear anywhere near as fast as lowers. Of course, this is a POS Ford and I don't drive POS Fords. :P

[SAUTO]

Originally Posted by kccrow

Feel free to correct it where I'm wrong, I have no quarrels with that. I'm not an expert, I just know in my experience it's extremely rare for uppers to wear anywhere near as fast as lowers. Of course, this is a POS Ford and I don't drive POS Fords. :P

Well I see just as many uppers fail as lowers.

You recommended not changing the uppers because they weren't bad but then recommended replacement of the outer tie rod ends just out of the blue. That really mate no sense to me.

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by SAUTO

Well I see just as many uppers fail as lowers.

You recommended not changing the uppers because they weren't bad but then recommended replacement of the outer tie rod ends just out of the blue. That really mate no sense to me.

Now that you and your wife have had your chuckle, I'll explain why it makes sense to me. If it still doesn't make sense to you, I'd love to hear the reasoning to put in my knowledge bank.
So here goes... When the ball joints begin to fail, there is much more vibration. That vibration and movement will be most noticeable at the outer tie rod ends, which are already adept at wearing in close proximity to the lower ball joints. The other factor here is that he's going to need an alignment anyhow, so why not replace the other part that will wear about as quickly right now and get one alignment done? If he doesn't, and they wear out in a few months, he's out another $100+ alignment fee. He did mention the symptom being the wheel jumping around, so it's very possible he has some rod damage already. He also mentioned not really wanting to do this again any time soon. It just seems for the extra $100, it'd be a wise time to do it.

Edit: Also, interesting on the uppers. I can't recall ever having an upper fail under 200,000 miles.

[SAUTO]

Originally Posted by kccrow

Now that you and your wife have had your chuckle, I'll explain why it makes sense to me. If it still doesn't make sense to you, I'd love to hear the reasoning to put in my knowledge bank.
So here goes... When the ball joints begin to fail, there is much more vibration. That vibration and movement will be most noticeable at the outer tie rod ends, which are already adept at wearing in close proximity to the lower ball joints. The other factor here is that he's going to need an alignment anyhow, so why not replace the other part that will wear about as quickly right now and get one alignment done? If he doesn't, and they wear out in a few months, he's out another $100+ alignment fee. He did mention the symptom being the wheel jumping around, so it's very possible he has some rod damage already. He also mentioned not really wanting to do this again any time soon. It just seems for the extra $100, it'd be a wise time to do it.

Edit: Also, interesting on the uppers. I can't recall ever having an upper fail under 200,000 miles.

I would think the vibration and movement would be felt worse by the upper ball joint that's right in line with the lower... and why wouldn't you replace the inner tire rods then? They would be getting the same treatment travelling from the outers.

[cooper barrett]

Originally Posted by SAUTO

I would think the vibration and movement would be felt worse by the upper ball joint that's right in line with the lower... and why wouldn't you replace the inner tire rods then? They would be getting the same treatment travelling from the outers.

He must have had a Goodyear alignment on a GM truck back in the day..upper lower, inner outer and idler arm and shocks.

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by SAUTO

I would think the vibration and movement would be felt worse by the upper ball joint that's right in line with the lower... and why wouldn't you replace the inner tire rods then? They would be getting the same treatment travelling from the outers.

I was thinking more along the lines of stress relative to the joint. More stress at the lower ball joint and outer tie rod end than at the upper ball joint and inner tie rod end, in addition to the vibration (more pressure + equivalent vibration = more wear?). Maybe this isn't true, but it would seem that way based on location and supports. From a physics point of view, I'm making sense in my own head. That, and there's probably ample reason engineers tend to favor upper ball joints integrated into the control arms rather than making them replaceable like the lowers. Same said about the inner tie rods being a major bitch to change compared to the outers. Either way, you see it daily and I don't (thankfully, backbreaking work you do) and I respect and appreciate your opinion on it.

[cooper barrett]

Originally Posted by kccrow

Now that you and your wife have had your chuckle, I'll explain why it makes sense to me. If it still doesn't make sense to you, I'd love to hear the reasoning to put in my knowledge bank.
So here goes... When the ball joints begin to fail, there is much more vibration. That vibration and movement will be most noticeable at the outer tie rod ends, which are already adept at wearing in close proximity to the lower ball joints. The other factor here is that he's going to need an alignment anyhow, so why not replace the other part that will wear about as quickly right now and get one alignment done? If he doesn't, and they wear out in a few months, he's out another $100+ alignment fee. He did mention the symptom being the wheel jumping around, so it's very possible he has some rod damage already. He also mentioned not really wanting to do this again any time soon. It just seems for the extra $100, it'd be a wise time to do it.

Edit: Also, interesting on the uppers. I can't recall ever having an upper fail under 200,000 miles.

This made even my dog laugh.