And so the "Matt Cassel to KC" Rumors Begin...

[FloridaMan88]

As if they hadn't started already...

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/f...&position=also


Matt Cassel draws interest


TAMPA - They might not have been one of the two Super Bowl participants last night, but the Patriots [team stats] still generated a lot of talk on Radio Row during the week.

With Matt Cassel making the rounds, there was plenty of speculation on how much interest he would draw should the Pats apply the franchise tag and then trade him.

The pundits’ top pick to land Cassel in that scenario is Kansas City. Obviously, the Scott Pioli factor weighs heavily in that choice, with the Pats former vice president of player personnel now calling the shots for the Chiefs.

“I’d really look at Pioli down there in Kansas City. Why wouldn’t he want him?” Sirius NFL radio analyst Jim Miller said. “He knows what the kid is capable of doing. So I think he’d be on their radar.”

Miller, like most analysts, doesn’t see the crop of quarterbacks in this year’s NFL Draft as particularly appealing. That boosts the draw for Cassel, especially if Pioli decides he’s not satisfied with the collection of QBs he inherited after taking over the job.

“I don’t think this is a strong quarterback draft. Everybody is saying Matthew Stafford of Georgia and Mark Sanchez of USC are going to go in the Top 10. I don’t believe that,” Miller said. “I don’t think those guys are ready. And I don’t think you’ll see the type of success guys like Matt Ryan or Joe Flacco had. They just haven’t played enough. So I can’t see teams wanting them.

“But if Kansas (City) were to make that deal, that’s their Matt Ryan. That’s their Joe Flacco. Unlike a Sanchez, for instance, they know he’s playing at a starter’s level. So to them, I think it’d be worth it to do. They’d get their starting quarterback, they know what he’s capable of doing, and they’ve seen him win games at the NFL level.”

Other experts, meanwhile, aren’t sure Pioli would want to deal with his former boss right out of the gate.

Some other teams figuring to make a pitch for Cassel include the New York Jets, Detroit, Minnesota, San Francisco, Carolina, Tampa Bay and Chicago.

As for what Cassel would land in a trade, there were differing opinions. Miller, for one, thought he would cost a second-round draft choice.

The decision to trade or keep Cassel will ultimately depend on Tom Brady [stats]’s health. While reports have him on target to play in the season opener, he still has a few hurdles to clear before that point following reconstructive surgery on his left knee and a subsequent staph infection.

“I think a lot is going to depend on where Kevin O’Connell is in his development. If they feel they can move Matt to benefit their team, they’ll do it,” said Miller, a one-time Pats backup quarterback. “It’s rolling the dice on Tom and whether he’s healthy, and two, can they do it with Kevin O’Connell? The question they have to ask is if O’Connell is as capable of what they have in Matt Cassel?”

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by Frankie

What I saw, unfortunately, was someone halfway between Carson Palmer and Ryan Leaf. That to me indicates too much of a gamble at 3.

People keep bringing up Ryan Leaf but unless Stafford is a complete head case that everyone on the team hates, it's a completely irrelevant comparison.

[RustShack]

Originally Posted by Frankie

The tried and true recourse of one without a strong case. Start calling your counterpart names to shitcover your own lack of confidence in your argument. I hope you feel better now.

Riddle me this Batman. How can you compare two guys who are no way physically the same and play in a totally different style of offense?

[DaKCMan AP]

Originally Posted by Frankie

The tried and true recourse of one without a strong case. Start calling your counterpart names to shitcover your own lack of confidence in your argument. I hope you feel better now.

Lack of a strong case? So you DO liken Stafford to Alex Smith? Really? Similar college level of competition? Nope. Similar arm strength? Nope. Similar mechanics? Nope. Similar mobility? Nope. Surely they played in the same type of offense? Nope. Not even close.

You are indeed a CP GENIOUS.

[Frankie]

Originally Posted by DaKCMan AP

Lack of a strong case? So you DO liken Stafford to Alex Smith? Really? Similar college level of competition? Nope. Similar arm strength? Nope. Similar mechanics? Nope. Similar mobility? Nope. Surely they played in the same type of offense? Nope. Not even close.

You are indeed a CP GENIOUS.

Show me where I compared the two. Here's another bit of perceived "knowledge" you pulled out of your ass. All I did was agree with another poster's fear that Stafford as a 1-3 pick may end up as bad a gamble as Smith. If you go back and read my post I have even capitalized the word MAY. Try chewing first before barfing.

[DaWolf]

http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal..._03_09/?page=3

Mike, I was thinking about trading possible trading partners for Matt Cassel and an interesting scenario came to mind. What do you think the odds would be of Kansas City trading Tony Gonzalez and a third-round pick to us for Matt Cassel? This makes sense to me because Scott Pioli is in KC and would do business with the Pats. Gonzalez has stated that he would like to play for a contender and the Chiefs need a franchise QB to build their team around. I think both teams can look at this as a win-win situation. The combo of Brady, Moss, Welker and Gonzalez would be downright scary to opposing teams. Also, we could then maybe trade Ben Watson for a mid-round pick as well. What are your thoughts?
Joe

A: Joe, often times when trades scenarios are presented, I feel that they are lopsided to one team. I don't think this one is. It's an interesting thought. What makes it fun to consider is that Gonzalez is obviously closer to the end of his career than the start, so while the Chiefs would be giving up one of their best assets, it's a shorter-term asset -- and in turn they'd be getting a potential long-term asset. That's why I think they might at least consider pulling the trigger on this type of deal, assuming they could work out a long-term contract for Cassel. Gonzalez is signed through 2011, with salaries of $4 million in 2009, $4.5 million in 2010 and $5.75 in 2011, so the Patriots, in turn, would have to feel those figures could work on their cap. I would still keep Watson, because I think he's more valuable to the Patriots than what the team would receive in a trade.

Mike, I just checked espn.com and they have a RUMOR that Cassel will be going to the Chiefs. Can you report on this and pass along any info. THIS IS BIG and I am surprised that the Globe did not break this story!
Mike

A: Mike, I checked out that item on ESPN.com (from the Insider section) and I thought it was interesting to trace its origins. My friend Karen Guregian of the Boston Herald had an item in Monday's editions in which she spoke with Sirius Radio analyst Jim Miller about possible destinations for Cassel in a trade, and Miller hypothesized that Kansas City was a possible destination because of the presence of former Patriots personnel chief Scott Pioli. I thought the headline of the article -- "Matt Cassel draws interest" -- could have led one to believe that other teams were declaring their interest. After reading the piece, however, it was Miller simply providing his expert opinion as to where Cassel might land in a possible trade. "I'd really look at Pioli down there in Kansas City. Why wouldn't he want him?" Miller said in the piece. "I think he'd be on their radar." In terms of my opinion on the Cassel-to-Chiefs story, I would agree that if the Chiefs were legitimately interested in Cassel that it would be big news. But based on the background of this situation, I don't think we can definitively say that at this point.

Mike, don't you think that Cassel will command at the minimum a first-round pick and a second- or third-rounder? He has proven to be a legitimate NFL QB over a full season. What other available QBs including those in the upcoming draft can match Cassel's resume?
dapats

A: What makes Cassel's situation so fascinating to me, dapats, is that there is no right answer. It only takes one team to take the plunge. At the Super Bowl, I asked a variety of NFL analysts their thoughts on what Cassel might yield in a trade, and there was no consensus. It ranged widely, in fact. My feeling is that any team trading for Cassel will need to factor in that 55 percent of the Patriots' offense came after the catch this season, easily the highest figure in the NFL. So I think it helps to have Randy Moss, Wes Welker and Kevin Faulk, as well as a well-oiled offensive system. This is to take nothing away from Cassel, who I believe deserves everything coming to him and did a great job this season. His accuracy and decision making were generally solid, contributing to that yards-after-catch total. So overall, if I was an interested team, I'd look long and hard at my own system and I'd have to project if Cassel would be as successful. With this in mind, I'd offer a conditional second-round draft choice that could improve to a first-rounder, because I'd want to protect myself if my very difficult projection was off. I'd also factor in leverage. Do the Patriots really plan to keep two quarterbacks on their roster that take up $29.2 million of their salary cap? Maybe they do. But I'd hold a hard line, figuring that while they might be asking for a first-rounder, they'd be willing to accept less because they will free up valuable space on their cap in doing so.

[ChiefRon]

Originally Posted by DaWolf

Mike, don't you think that Cassel will command at the minimum a first-round pick and a second- or third-rounder? He has proven to be a legitimate NFL QB over a full season. What other available QBs including those in the upcoming draft can match Cassel's resume?
dapats

A: What makes Cassel's situation so fascinating to me, dapats, is that there is no right answer. It only takes one team to take the plunge. At the Super Bowl, I asked a variety of NFL analysts their thoughts on what Cassel might yield in a trade, and there was no consensus. It ranged widely, in fact. My feeling is that any team trading for Cassel will need to factor in that 55 percent of the Patriots' offense came after the catch this season, easily the highest figure in the NFL. So I think it helps to have Randy Moss, Wes Welker and Kevin Faulk, as well as a well-oiled offensive system. This is to take nothing away from Cassel, who I believe deserves everything coming to him and did a great job this season. His accuracy and decision making were generally solid, contributing to that yards-after-catch total. So overall, if I was an interested team, I'd look long and hard at my own system and I'd have to project if Cassel would be as successful. With this in mind, I'd offer a conditional second-round draft choice that could improve to a first-rounder, because I'd want to protect myself if my very difficult projection was off. I'd also factor in leverage. Do the Patriots really plan to keep two quarterbacks on their roster that take up $29.2 million of their salary cap? Maybe they do. But I'd hold a hard line, figuring that while they might be asking for a first-rounder, they'd be willing to accept less because they will free up valuable space on their cap in doing so.

This.

If Pioli pulls the trigger on a trade, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but it would leave a bad taste in my mouth if he didn't protect us in some way, like maybe a conditional 3rd round choice that could escalate based on performance.

Pats fans are overvaluing the guy (I'm using the same reasoning that others are using, his supporting cast/scheme), but I don't think Pioli will completely whiff on leverage.

I'd rather take a flyer on Sanchez/Stafford because of the possible upside.

[DaWolf]

Originally Posted by ChiefRon

This.

If Pioli pulls the trigger on a trade, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but it would leave a bad taste in my mouth if he didn't protect us in some way, like maybe a conditional 3rd round choice that could escalate based on performance.

Pats fans are overvaluing the guy (I'm using the same reasoning that others are using, his supporting cast/scheme), but I don't think Pioli will completely whiff on leverage.

I'd rather take a flyer on Sanchez/Stafford because of the possible upside.

I agree. I think the benefit here is that Pioli knows the guy inside and out and knows exactly why he was successful and what system he'd need to be successful in. He also knows the Pats motivations inside and out and would know how to get fair value in a negotiation and if the Pats want to get his salary off the cap or are willing to hold it. The other benefit is that Pioli is not so emotionally attached to guys like DV that he's going to start publicly campaigning that Trent Green is worth a first round pick and we have to do what we can to get Green, BEFORE the deal is done. If Pioli and the coach want this guy, at least they'll have the best inside info on him...

[Christofire]

If Cassell had his spectacular season without Randy Moss, I'd be more interested in him. But Moss is an awfully good security blanket (catches everything) and decoy. Plus, I don't want to give my 3rd overall pick to the Patriots on principle alone. Perhaps a player + pick trade I could go for ... but not our first rounder.

[CoMoChief]

Originally Posted by arc

People keep bringing up Ryan Leaf but unless Stafford is a complete head case that everyone on the team hates, it's a completely irrelevant comparison.

That and Ryan Leaf completely sucked. and he didnt suck because everyone on the team hated him

[CoMoChief]

Lets see what Thigpen can do.

[Sure-Oz]

Originally Posted by Christofire

If Cassell had his spectacular season without Randy Moss, I'd be more interested in him. But Moss is an awfully good security blanket (catches everything) and decoy. Plus, I don't want to give my 3rd overall pick to the Patriots on principle alone. Perhaps a player + pick trade I could go for ... but not our first rounder.

He barely threw it to moss and could never connect on the long ball. He loved tossing those short routes to welker and some to gaffney. Moss's #'s would've been much higher if the guy could get it down field.

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by CoMoChief

That and Ryan Leaf completely sucked. and he didnt suck because everyone on the team hated him

He didn't suck because he lacked talent. He sucked because he was an immature dirtbag who couldn't handle the pressure of being "the guy" in the NFL (which is why everyone hated him). Anything else is revisionist history.

[Sure-Oz]

Originally Posted by arc

He didn't suck because he lacked talent. He sucked because he was an immature dirtbag who couldn't handle the pressure of being "the guy" in the NFL (which is why everyone hated him). Anything else is revisionist history.

I think the game vs the chiefs ruined him, he was a big ass baby anyway.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by arc

He didn't suck because he lacked talent. He sucked because he was an immature dirtbag who couldn't handle the pressure of being "the guy" in the NFL (which is why everyone hated him). Anything else is revisionist history.

This.

3) Have his head screwed on straight enough to handle all the pressure and scrutiny to which all NFL QB's are subjected. (A Ryan Leaf fiasco can cripple a franchise for years - "You couldn't get anyone to say anything nice about Leaf when he was leaving," Pioli said. "His teammates were happy to see him leave Washington State. He was an asshole.")

[Frosty]

It's funny - earlier Frankie said that he saw a cross between Ryan Leaf and Carson Palmer when he watched Stafford play. A cross between those two guys in college, from a pure talent standpoint, would have teams fighting over the top spot to get him.