Reviewing the draft.

[Direckshun]

Looking over this draft, it kept feeling to me like the Chiefs were playing with house money. In the first round, I do think Veach was anchored to 31 by Clark Hunt wanting to teabag the NFL with the trophies- at the end of the night. I personally believe along with most of you that Hunt anchored the 2023 1st from being spent on Veach's quest to trade up for Jameson Williams last year. And after that display to close out Thursday night, I have to believe that Hunt anchored Veach again this year. He wanted the 31st, and he wanted the trophies out.

Hell, it would not surprise me if he laid into Veach a mild amount to draft Keion White, since Keion was in the green room. Bring out the trophies, dunk on the NFL with the last pick of the draft, take a player who's in the green room that can come out, slap on a Chiefs ballcap and get interviewed in front of Kansas City. I think he's probably okay with the hometown kid though who grew up worshipping Arrowhead and Tamba Hali. I've already said my piece on FAU; I think he's a really good piece to add and makes this roster better over the next 5-10 years; it was deflating only slightly because one of my favorite players in this draft played the exact same position and was literally taken the pick before to the only team that can beat us.

So.... this is the kind of shit you guys hate me saying, but Hunt's hubris looked damn cool but for all we know, it actually made the Chiefs less likely to win any number of Super Bowls in the future, as I think Nolan Smith is going to be a terror off the edge in Philadelphia, especially with Davis and Carter torturing interior lines. This draft by the Eagles will allow them to win a Super Bowl very soon. And while I think Niang would be perfectly fine at right tackle for the upcoming season... that Eagles line may have forced KC's hand a bit more than usual to spend that third on a tackle. My guess is that, unless the Bengals luck into another upset at Arrowhead in January, we're playing the Eagles twice next year.

That's pretty much it. That's the only team that I think can beat the Chiefs on a neutral field. It's far too early, none of these rookies have played a snap. The Bengals are hot on our heels, however, and the Bills may get to our level if they land Hopkins, who still remains an X factor.

Moving on.

I have been on the Rashee Rice train for several months now. SMU does not concern me at all: colleges all over the nation wanted this guy to transfer to them. He could have played anywhere. I completely stand by this rundown of him that I wrote in January:

The depth chart for the WR room for 2023 as it stands on this date in history: Valdez-Scantling, Toney, Moore, Justyn Ross. Justin Watson is a safe re-sign, which I would. JuJu would bring this WR corps close to completion, and I'd absolutely extend him. The Chiefs need his toughness, his fantastic hands, his YAC, his rapport with Mahomes.

But holy smokes. If JuJu is a bridge too far, allow me to sell you a guy with the JuJu skillset and Pro Bowl upside. Rashee Rice is a fantastic, big-bodied, angry-as-hell, hard blocking, jump ball dominating, alpha personality pissant who will put your DB in the turf first chance he gets. His film is so much fun, don't let the small school deter you: this is a guy who would start on any offense in college football. And in Kansas City? He'd pair with Kadarius Toney to give you the angriest WR room in the NFL.

That said, he's going to go dormant for a year, Skyy Moore style, as Andy Reid basically teaches him how to play an NFL route tree. His responsibilities at SMU have been extremely straight forward; he's never had to make the myriad of calculations that Reid asks of you. I trust Reid for that development, however, and this guy could be a Pro Bowl replacement for JuJu in Year 2. Slam dunk pick at the end of the 1st (if you're not already eyeing a more critical position for the team).

This all being said: I still think I make a play for Hopkins. He's almost certainly going to get cut now, and I imagine the Chiefs are first on the assembly line to add him once he does. The Bills and Ravens still make sense for him, but I'm not 100% certain how the Bills afford him. The Ravens have a shot. The Chiefs have an outside shot to afford him. I think you're only going to need him for a year if Rice develops well.

The 2022 WR corps: Smith-Schuster, Valdez-Scantling, Toney, Hardman, Moore, Watson
The 2023 WR corps: Toney, Valdez-Scantling, Moore, Watson, Rice, James

I think most of us would probably conclude that this WR is a half-step back from last year's, along with another-year-older Travis Kelce and a RB grouping that's still pretty much Pacheco and the corpse of Clyde Edwards-Helaire, end of list. It's a group that emphasizes separation more than last year's, but continues to need a Z-receiver X factor that Andy Reid loves to draw plays up for. That's a key reason I think we shouldn't sleep on John Ross, who won't need to do anything for Reid than be an even faster De'Anthony Thomas.

Wanya Morris is someone who the team will give every chance to win, but I have watched a ton of OU over the last couple years. This is a guy who, on paper, has literally everything you need to feel confident. He fits Andy Reid's mold at tackle, he plays angry, he's greatly nimble. He comes from an OU offensive line system that thrives under Reid, and already has familiarity with the right side of the current Chiefs' line. He's a Duke Mayweather guy, known to be a hard worker, and will 100% come in with the right attitude. My belief is that he will start at tackle Week 1.

My only hesitation is his tape. That's a big worry, I think. Morris is less ready to go than you think he may be, based on how polished OU lineman are, but he's going to take a ton of work. He gets beat in a lot of different ways, too: inside, over the edge, through his body.

Now, he plays right tackle, so long as Taylor is fine on the other side, Mahomes and Reid can navigate his struggles. But he is more of a pound of clay than you think. However, if you showed me this guy's tape, which I did not like for a 3rd round prospect, and say "what would it take for you to draft this guy in the third round," I'd probably say I'd need X, Y, and Z in order to feel good about it, and it's all there in Morris and Kansas City. This is why you have a hall of fame head coach, right?

The third day picks fall into two buckets. The first bucket is just one player: Keandre Coburn. This guy may legitimately start by the end of the year, and I honestly think he offers more of a rush for a nose tackle than people think. I don't think he's an immovable block of granite like Mazi Smith. I think by the end of his contract, he's going to be a starting nose tackle who can man 30% of the snaps any given game, entirely on early downs and short-yardage situations. But I'd put his peak on par with 2nd and 3rd year Derrick Nnadi.

The other three picks, Conner, Thompson, and Jones, were all love letters to Dave Toub. The Chiefs were poor at special teams last year, because Veach built such a deep roster that there simply weren't many "core" special teamers: guys who have little purpose on the roster other than to crush special teams. Conner and Thompson and Jones are those guys. Conner and Jones will both be four phase guys and play very little on defense, probably for the entirety of their rookie deals here. Thompson is a critical add for Toub: Toub needs a long string bean in the middle of his blocking units.

He got so desperate towards the end of the season that he literally had Orlando Brown standing behind the blocking unit, jumping up half-heartedly with his hand in the air. That's clearly a coordinator who is scraping the bottom of the barrel. And Kaindoh, who used to be that guy, couldn't get activated this year. The Chiefs desperately needed that guy, and I legitimately do think they'd spend a 5th on it. I bet Toub has been grousing about the lack of core special teamers for 15 months. The Chiefs probably liked their roster after Day 2, didn't see anybody who could change their plans on Day 3, and felt like they could body out some special teams.

What's left: I suspect the Chiefs will keep their finger on the pulse of the Hopkins situation. They lack bodies for the backfield, and I don't think their Day One fullback is on the roster yet. If they bring back Jerick McKinnon, they may not even sign a fullback, because McKinnon towards the end of the year was used to block a little towards the end of the year for Pacheco. And I think we're all going to be hitting F5 twelve times an hour at the November trade deadline to see what nose tackle the Chiefs trade for, as I'm guessing the DTs on the roster now will get steamrolled this season.

Aside from that: I think this team is a lock to be in the AFCCG again. I am watching the Bills situation, but I continue to think the Bengals are the only team who can stay with us. But I still don't know how they're doing what they're doing over there.

The only wildcard for me: the Aaron Rodgers Jets. The Jets absolutely smashed the draft last year, and if they have another draft that's even in the ballpark of that last one, they could shock some people, right up until Rodgers turns into a pumpkin in January yet again.

[kozzman555]

Great write up. I compared Rice's 2021 highlights to his 2022 and i think it was clear for a lot of them in 2022 he was missing a half step from the previous year, which I believe can be chalked up to playing injured. If he's even close to D-Hop or Aiyuk, I'll be ecstatic.

The one thing that really puzzled me more than anything else in the draft is the Bengals draft. They had some ok picks, but they didn't take any O-line players?? That is reaaaally going to come back and bite them this year and beyond I think. Burrow got wrecked last year and it probably cost them another Super Bowl appearance. We all know what Orlando Brown is and isn't and I don't see him being as great as the Bengals think he will be.

I get their 1st four picks, Murphy, Turner and Battle will all be starters for them. Charlie Jones and Iosivas are there for when they can't afford to keep Higgins, Chase, and Boyd all together. But them not addressing their O-Line is baffling.

[Direckshun]

I think the Bengals OL is very good, actually. They just suffered a ton of attrition.

Soon as that squad is healthy, which should be by Week One, I think they’re going to be golden again. But the same depth issues that plagued them last year will plague them again if there are more injuries.

The Chiefs, by contrast, have good depth on their OL.

[kozzman555]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

I think the Bengals OL is very good, actually. They just suffered a ton of attrition.

Soon as that squad is healthy, which should be by Week One, I think they’re going to be golden again. But the same depth issues that plagued them last year will plague them again if there are more injuries.

The Chiefs, by contrast, have good depth on their OL.

That's my point. They have bros that were injured and they don't address any O-line depth in the draft in case it happens again? That's wild.

[Chargem]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

Looking over this draft, it kept feeling to me like the Chiefs were playing with house money. In the first round, I do think Veach was anchored to 31 by Clark Hunt wanting to teabag the NFL with the trophies- at the end of the night. I personally believe along with most of you that Hunt anchored the 2023 1st from being spent on Veach's quest to trade up for Jameson Williams last year. And after that display to close out Thursday night, I have to believe that Hunt anchored Veach again this year. He wanted the 31st, and he wanted the trophies out.

Hell, it would not surprise me if he laid into Veach a mild amount to draft Keion White, since Keion was in the green room. Bring out the trophies, dunk on the NFL with the last pick of the draft, take a player who's in the green room that can come out, slap on a Chiefs ballcap and get interviewed in front of Kansas City. I think he's probably okay with the hometown kid though who grew up worshipping Arrowhead and Tamba Hali. I've already said my piece on FAU; I think he's a really good piece to add and makes this roster better over the next 5-10 years; it was deflating only slightly because one of my favorite players in this draft played the exact same position and was literally taken the pick before to the only team that can beat us.

So.... this is the kind of shit you guys hate me saying, but Hunt's hubris looked damn cool but for all we know, it actually made the Chiefs less likely to win any number of Super Bowls in the future, as I think Nolan Smith is going to be a terror off the edge in Philadelphia, especially with Davis and Carter torturing interior lines. This draft by the Eagles will allow them to win a Super Bowl very soon. And while I think Niang would be perfectly fine at right tackle for the upcoming season... that Eagles line may have forced KC's hand a bit more than usual to spend that third on a tackle. My guess is that, unless the Bengals luck into another upset at Arrowhead in January, we're playing the Eagles twice next year.

Cool story that you made up. Clark Hunt forced Veach's hand to the detriment of the team, but also wanted White but didn't get his way? Maybe try and keep the narrative more consistent for the next story time, it makes it more believable.

I think the Eagles had a good draft, but did they get that much better? Hargrave was an absolute beast last year, I think the best outcome is their line is the same next year, very much doubt its better.

Also, I think the belief that the Chiefs may have reacted mid draft to how the Eagles were drafting is honestly batshit crazy.

The 2022 WR corps: Smith-Schuster, Valdez-Scantling, Toney, Hardman, Moore, Watson
The 2023 WR corps: Toney, Valdez-Scantling, Moore, Watson, Rice, James

I think most of us would probably conclude that this WR is a half-step back from last year's, along with another-year-older Travis Kelce and a RB grouping that's still pretty much Pacheco and the corpse of Clyde Edwards-Helaire, end of list. It's a group that emphasizes separation more than last year's, but continues to need a Z-receiver X factor that Andy Reid loves to draw plays up for. That's a key reason I think we shouldn't sleep on John Ross, who won't need to do anything for Reid than be an even faster De'Anthony Thomas.

Toney was a mid season acquisition in 2022, I think if you're putting him in the list of 2022 receivers you're not really comparing apples to apples.

I'd probably argue if you were to compare the WR group on May 1st 2022 to May 1st 2023, the 2023 group is better, mainly due to Toney.

I also think there's close to a zero percent chance the Chiefs go after Hopkins. He is not going to play for cheap, and I would be shocked if he was cut. Even if Arizona are done with him, better to trade him at the deadline this season for an actual return.

[Chris Meck]

Yeah, some people just have to see a nefarious conspiracy everywhere. That's all I'm going to say on that.

Some of these picks were because poor special teams play was a problem in '22, no doubt. But also because the path to playing time is blocked at many positions by young players that need to play to develop. There are only so many spots where there's an opening.

I think it was a solid 'B' draft, with potential to be another 'A' draft is Connor or Thompson become plus players.

[O.city]

FAU is your typical guy that was really really good in college, doesnt' "test" as well, drops because of it, goes to a good team and is a 10 year DE that puts up 8 sacks a year.

We've seen it happen with Pittsburgh so many times, the Chiefs do it now.

I just can't seem to worry to much about what the Eagles do. They're in the NFC, I'm not gonna go out of my way to really care to much. Great draft, sure.

I'm not overly sold on Hurts at QB, so whatever.

[duncan_idaho]

Yeah, I'm never going to buy the idea that Clark Hunt forced Veach's hand on anything.

If Veach had come to him and said "Hey, I can move back to 35, still get the guy we'd get at 31, and add another 4th round pick; this deal makes sense for us." he isn't going to pass that up for a press conference level thing.

The draft is going to turn on one of FAU, Rice, or Morris becoming a high-level starter. I think they have a good chance at least one does, and decent odds at lesat 2 are really good players.

I am not as scared of the Eagles as some. Yeah, they added some flashy picks on the defensive side, but I think Nolan Smith is more a combine warrior than a gameday warrior.

They're good, but the offensive coordinator shift is nothing to sneeze at there, and I think people are overlooking how much better the Chiefs' defense should be.

Another year of experience for the rookies who played so much in 2022.

A much more talented DL, with more ways to "win" as pass rushers (Now have two guys who can offer an outside speed rush component; Omenihu is a better version of Frank Clark/Dunlap).

A better LB corps, with a true WLB option who is good enough to wear the green dot in the dime (if Spagnuolo is willing to go back to the setup he had with Hitchens/Niemann).

I think they're deeper at S, too. Cook will improve with experience, and Mike Edwards is a good ballhawk that I think is being overlooked by many.

[duncan_idaho]

Another thing I'll add:

I know people didn't like the Lions draft, but I think that team has a great shot to be the NFC representative next year. They have made some really nice additions to their secondary (Sutton, Gardner-Johnson, Mosely, Brian Branch, upgraded in the middle with Campbell (even if he was overdrafted), and should get more out of their class of 22 rookie pass rushers.

Gibbs will give them a lot more electricity than Swift did last year, and Montgomery should shine as the gritty part of the time share.

[The Franchise]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

Another thing I'll add:

I know people didn't like the Lions draft, but I think that team has a great shot to be the NFC representative next year. They have made some really nice additions to their secondary (Sutton, Gardner-Johnson, Mosely, Brian Branch, upgraded in the middle with Campbell (even if he was overdrafted), and should get more out of their class of 22 rookie pass rushers.

Gibbs will give them a lot more electricity than Swift did last year, and Montgomery should shine as the gritty part of the time share.

The Lions absolutely killed the second day of the draft. And as much as I didn't like their 1st round picks...those guys will start.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by Chargem

Cool story that you made up. Clark Hunt forced Veach's hand to the detriment of the team, but also wanted White but didn't get his way? Maybe try and keep the narrative more consistent for the next story time, it makes it more believable.

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

Yeah, some people just have to see a nefarious conspiracy everywhere. That's all I'm going to say on that.

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

Yeah, I'm never going to buy the idea that Clark Hunt forced Veach's hand on anything.

If Veach had come to him and said "Hey, I can move back to 35, still get the guy we'd get at 31, and add another 4th round pick; this deal makes sense for us." he isn't going to pass that up for a press conference level thing.

I have more to say on the more substantial feedback in this thread. But I thought it was common knowledge that Hunt anchored the 2023 1st round pick so Veach couldn't trade up to get Jameson Williams last year. Do people deny that credible rumor?

If we believe that, it's not a leap of logic at all that Hunt was committed to the Chiefs' pageantry this year, and to have the display ready to roll at 31 soon as the Chiefs won the Super Bowl.

I don't think he dictates players, however -- there's no evidence for that. He's not Jerry Jones. But there is credible reporting that was not exactly denied by Veach this past weekend that Hunt will push the team towards pageantry, up to and including anchoring a draft pick.

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

I have more to say on the more substantial feedback in this thread. But I thought it was common knowledge that Hunt anchored the 2023 1st round pick so Veach couldn't trade up to get Jameson Williams last year. Do people deny that credible rumor?

If we believe that, it's not a leap of logic at all that Hunt was committed to the Chiefs' pageantry this year, and to have the display ready to roll at 31 soon as the Chiefs won the Super Bowl.

I don't think he dictates players, however -- there's no evidence for that. He's not Jerry Jones. But there is credible reporting that was not exactly denied by Veach this past weekend that Hunt will push the team towards pageantry, up to and including anchoring a draft pick.

Depends on how much stock you take in an off-hand, joking comment made by a General Manager. I don't place much in it.

If they were willing to sacrifice that much capital for Jameson Williams, wouldn't it have made more sense to take the Jets initial offer of #10 for Tyreek Hill, vs. the varied package of picks the Dolphins offered?

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by The Franchise

The Lions absolutely killed the second day of the draft. And as much as I didn't like their 1st round picks...those guys will start.

I really like Sam LePorta. He's going to be a dynamite weapon for them, paired with that running game.

[Chargem]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

I have more to say on the more substantial feedback in this thread. But I thought it was common knowledge that Hunt anchored the 2023 1st round pick so Veach couldn't trade up to get Jameson Williams last year. Do people deny that credible rumor?

If we believe that, it's not a leap of logic at all that Hunt was committed to the Chiefs' pageantry this year, and to have the display ready to roll at 31 soon as the Chiefs won the Super Bowl.

I don't think he dictates players, however -- there's no evidence for that. He's not Jerry Jones. But there is credible reporting that was not exactly denied by Veach this past weekend that Hunt will push the team towards pageantry, up to and including anchoring a draft pick.

Sure, I can believe that last year Clark expressed a wish to keep the 2023 1st round pick because the draft was in Kansas City. Veach made a comment to that effect in his post 1st round press conference. Whether that was an iron-clad rule, just an expression of wishes or even a joke is just guess work, Veach has downplayed that comment at every turn afterwards.

I think the part about a trade up for Williams was just complete fiction, I don't think there were any actual insider/rumors about the specific trade up slot or player, it was just the one throw away comment from a conference that got a laugh.

But Veach also said in his press conference after this first round this year that they called around about trading up and AFC rivals were playing hardball on the compensation, AND that they considered trading back and the offers they got were too far back (specifically said in the 40s). So for this conspiracy theory to work, you have to believe Veach is creating elaborate lies? And you have to believe that Veach was not lying/joking in 2022 but IS lying in 2023 with his press conference comments?

How does rolling the trophies out specifically at pick 31 make it "more pageantry" anyway? You're telling me that the gesture is somehow diminished if they trade up to 27? How? You think they can't roll those little plinths and the trophies out for pick 21 and then take them away again?

Wouldn't a trade up to get a guy also be a "crowd pleaser" for the hometown crowd? Wouldn't the fans have gone wild for a trade up in round 1? They did in subsequent rounds.

[Nightfyre]

The only conspiracy theory I buy about trading draft picks is that other AFC contenders will not be willing to allow us to trade up early without paying a significant ransom premium. Call it a success tax.