***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***

[JakeF]

A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana

Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.

Originally Posted by Dartgod

People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.

California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.

“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”

The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.

The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”

Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.

The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.

The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.

A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.

Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.

“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”

It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.

“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”

On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.

“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”

According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.

More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.

But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.

“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”

CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.

Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.

“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”

[Bugeater]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Not at that concentration.

Seriously? Even if it's being ran on the high end near 10ppm?

[FloridaMan88]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Not at that concentration.

So is that different than “inactivating” the virus as the CDC indicates chlorine will do?

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...php/water.html

There is no evidence that COVID-19 can be spread to humans through the use of pools, hot tubs or spas, or water playgrounds. Proper operation, maintenance, and disinfection (e.g., with chlorine and bromine) of pools, hot tubs or spas, and water playgrounds should inactivate the virus that causes COVID-19.

[Bugeater]

Originally Posted by TLO

If someone pisses in the pool, does that have any impact?

This I can say with confidence...the water will turn red and everyone will know it was you. DON'T PISS IN THE POOL.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Titty Meat

INSERT MADE IN CHINA JOKE

“Our findings suggest that there is somewhere between 50- and 80-fold more infections in our county than what’s known by the number of cases than are reported by our department of public health," Dr. Eran Bendavid, the Stanford professor who led the study, told ABC News.
If the study's numbers are accurate, the true mortality and hospitalization rates of COVID-19 are both substantially lower than current estimates, and due to lag between infection and death, researchers project a true mortality rate between .12 and .20.

If the true mortality rate is 0.12, then it would be effectively impossible for New York to have more than 24,000 deaths when this is all said and done, and that is assuming that every single person in New York state is infected. Given that most of the recent tests have demonstrated positives in the high 30 percent range, even if you account for a high false negative rate and bump the rate from 38% to 47% (and this is not even testing a random sample; this is testing people most likely to have the virus), then you would already have a true mortality rate of

17,131/(20,000,000*0.47)=0.18% if no one else in New York dies

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

non-political politic posts? That’s my thing.

/I kid. Not serious disclaimer.

Yes.

Spoiler!

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Dropped

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

We will need some sort of universal income to keep a floor under American citizens. Or there will really be trouble in the streets. Same argument that most are getting an advance on their 2020 tax refund soon. Politicians saying the virus isn't their fault. Not their fault they don't have a job, Automation will effect some industries more than others but all will take a hit on jobs. It wont be the workers fault.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

okay, dropped.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

the president has no business pushing an unproven drug from the White House podium. It’s dangerous. People, dumbasses but still human beings, have already died trying to get this “miracle drug” into them. Pushing people to give their doctors and gave them write prescriptions as a preventive dose has not been proven to work.

Totally different if your going to be dead soon. Why not try anything at that point. But, that’s not what’s being advocated for from the White House podium.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I guess I’m not surprised. I don’t see partisan politics here. Both sides signed off on the deal. They didn’t say, hey this is just an advance on your future tax refund that you have to pay back.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Even though no one in the thread is saying Trump sucks or Trump is fantastic, there sure is a lot of DC in this thread lately.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I don’t want anyone to think I’m pointing fingers at anyone. There will be plenty of time for finger pointing later. And when that does happen, it’s probably not going to be one fault line but many.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

You sure give some thought to why you think that shortage of PPE's gets "old" to you. I think your thoughts are that this damages your side of the political aisle. I don't see that angle.

I've not seen one story where the doctors, nurses are blaming anyone specifically for the PPE shortage. Just letting people know they desperately need PPE's to protect themselves and their patients. You keep hearing about it because the healthcare workers lives are at risk. Doctors and nurses are dying due to a lack of PPE's.

This isn't about politics. It's about supporting our front line solders fighting this virus, like Dirk Diglers daughter. Getting them the equipment to stay alive while they save us.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

so the government won’t do what is necessary, we the people need to resolve it with “lead”?

I didn’t think people were allowed to talk like that on here, not even in the DC forum.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Kudos to the President for extending the social distancing CDC recommendations till April 30th.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

non politics?

And...

Spoiler!

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

This is reality. You should join the real world instead of the rainbows and unicorns world you are living in.

People don't want to read personal beefs in here, You need to stop personal attacks that **** up this page AND then cause people to respond to your personal attacks. It can go on for pages. That may be okay in DC but we aint posting in DC. Just stop for crissakes. Stay on topic.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Dr. Fauci on Trump's Easter coronavirus timeline: "He was making an aspirational projection to give people some hope. But he's listening to us when we say we've really got to reevaluate it in real-time and any decision we make has to be based on the data."

— Ryan Struyk (@ryanstruyk) March 27, 2020

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

the main lesson historians learned from the 1918 Spanish flu was to tell the truth. Every government downplayed or hid their real numbers from the public.

Ironically, the flu didn’t originate in Spain. Spain was the only country that told the truth at the beginning. Hence it was named after them.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I don’t care who’s fault it is. Hence the deliberate “they”. I have no idea who’s “fault” it is. FEMA, Congress, the Governor, the President, Obama’s, the States, the Hospital etc. it’s probably multiple players fault. But, here we are and it needs to get fixed immediately.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

so she pulled a Rand Paul that bitch. Causing worry for no good reason. Payback needs to be meted out.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Bring on the Easter celebrations!

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

It’s always a fine line restricting constitutional guaranteed rights. Free speech but you can’t yell fire in a crowd etc.

I’m not worried about this situation compared to the precedent that would be set. We all agree that it’s at least a crisis. What about the next president? What if they say we have a “crisis” and we need to take away “X” constitional rights?

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

glad to hear. We are a country that really cherishes our freedom of movement. We need to voluntarily do what’s in our own selfish and communities best interests. We have to choose. Even though there may be beaches full of spring breakers, it’s not worth it to our democracy to involve the police in enforcement.

**** cops stopping Americans asking to see their papers.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

this is a perfect “”DC” response. I asked what you would have done differently and you come back with a personal attack.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

To keep bringing up “house arrest” is a political statement.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I cant respond to this question in this thread due to the restrictions of the lounge.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I have no idea on her politics. Don’t care. Booze and TP... I’m all in

And...

Spoiler!

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Wheres Dr. Fauci? Two days in a row he hasn't been at the press conference. The most knowledgeable person on the planet with infectious diseases isn't there. He's the only one not lying to us or giving us a bunch of BS. #wheresfauci

Originally Posted by DaFace

Dude. Are you just completely incapable of making a post in this thread that doesn't try to coyly allude to government failure? Get the **** out of the thread if you can't help yourself.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I apologize to all. My bad. Won’t happen again.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I watching my P's and Q's. Just posting facts, welll as we know them currently. Posting non-political opinions.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Putting aside what he's actually saying.....

At times like these we expect our leadership to be "presidential". Talk "presidential". Empathy. Here's what we are doing, This is the plan. Anything that's not that, freaks people out more.

Doesnt really matter which political team your on

I hate Rick Scott so much ever since his company stole $1.2 Billion from medicare in Missouri. Moved to Florida and found out he was governor.

We had two hurricanes under him. He did a helluva job. In hurricanes getting gas for cars and generators in the aftermath is key. He got the police to escort gasoline tankers to stations from the docks. Gave the stations exceptions to make it more readily available. Brought in electrical trucks from all over the USA. Paused a lot of collections. etc. Got him a senate seat for it. He earned it during those hurricanes.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Sorry man, I've already been warned. I have to let this conversation go.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

my non-response due to this being an apolitical thread was to address society’s value of science. Nothing to do with the NEA.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I can’t respond to this without political points. Just letting you know I didn’t ignore the post.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

this thread has been great about leaving politics out of it for 3-4 days now.

Some personal issues between posters flare up But not politics.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

yep, there can’t be 100% non-political tints to the posts in this thread. It’s the nature of the discussion. Some leeway that’s usually not allowed in the lounge was merited. A discussion of something that effects us all helps everyone.

They have set the line to not cross. And everyone, or most are self-modifying their views and posts to stay under that line.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

thought you were banned for political posts?

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

No way can I respond to this without becoming political.

FTR, My family and I have been practicing social distancing since Thursday. And will for the duration.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

exactly. Not calling out or mentioning names or tribes. Just a generic them. I’m trying to follow the rules in a topic that has obvious political entanglements.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I was just giving an illustration/example on how things are viewed differently with one different part. I think it was a great example. Nothing political about it at all. It’s just a fact. You can’t yell and ban me for partisan BS on simple facts. A violent act or murder is viewed differently if it’s a terroist. That’s a partisan take? GTFO.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

come on man, show me one comment that’s not on Twitter, where someone wanted grandma and grandpa to die if that gets Trump out of office?

Katrina was the biggest **** up possible and Bush did okay afterwards so I think your theory that a botched handling of this changes much political. Everyone already has their teams.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

who knows if they are telling us the truth? The military finally came clean and told us the truth, it’s not going well in Afghanistan despite 18 years of military help. We will never be able to defeat the Tailban. No chance to have a stable government without our military help on the ground. 18 years of Presidents allowing the military to lie to the public when they knew better.

How we supposed to trust information when there is a personal benefit to withhold bad information and publicize information that works well for the current presidents own personal political benefit? The current president has taking lying to a whole new level.

As I said, every President lies to us. We accept this as part of the deal when it comes to health care or a wall etc. but, when it comes to a possible deadly pandemic, we have to trust what they are telling us. I’m not buying anything they tell us until I hear it from independent medical professionals.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

glad Trump is listening to me.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

come on man, show me one comment that’s not on Twitter, where someone wanted grandma and grandpa to die if that gets Trump out of office?

Katrina was the biggest **** up possible and Bush did okay afterwards so I think your theory that a botched handling of this changes much political. Everyone already has their teams.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I just spoke to Rep. Gaetz, who said he was put into a "closed up room" on AF1 after he found out he might have been exposed to Covid19.

After landing, Trump "coaxed" him up front before leaving.

"He was not hyper cautious about being in the same space that I was in."

— Ben Terris (@bterris) March 9, 2020

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

You can’t say others are an idiot when in the same quote he says “we did a good job”. It’s not over. Whether the President did a good job or not is still to be decided.

And...

Spoiler!

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

That answer is political so, cant answer in this thread.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

But that only works if the politicians want that to happen on both sides of the aisle. This isn’t partisan.

I’d say that the mom and pop bar and restaurant isn’t contributing a lot to a congressman’s or Senators campaign but these big corporations and Ruth Chris’s of the world contribute a lot.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

I'd say I'm more up to speed on politics than the average person. Recognize the "activists" on both sides.

I've never heard of her before. I thought it was funny too. Had no idea she was a conservative activist. I thought she was some "woke" NY liberal.

If I'm up to speed on a persons politics way more than the average person, how can I or we supposed to know what a persons political leanings are if the actual post is not political? That seems a high bar to clear.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

We have a different form of government than Sweden. The Governors decide in their state, not the President. If the governors don't agree with whatever the President is planning, the plan is dead in the water.

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Yeah **** that shit. This ain't China. The government tracking our movements. How could such a bad idea come out of the smart people at Google and Apple?

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Can you provide something for its scientific proof other than an appearance on a right wing partisan TV opinion show? Like a published peer reviewed article in the New England Journal of Medicine? Or any other non-partisan scientific group?

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

It's not only the governor handled it sooo bad, he was a total **** up with his response, its that he stopped local counties and cities from taking steps to protect their community. He went to court and sued counties and cities that they didn't have the authority to close a beach or order a stay at home order for their local city or county.

Apologies if I missed a few.

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by TLO

Dr. Birx - not a US geography expert.

both her and that CDC guy put up way too complicated slides. They need to bullett point that info. Go to the 10K ft. level so people will pay attention.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Bugeater

Seriously? Even if it's being ran on the high end near 10ppm?

Aren't most pools closer to 3-5 to avoid irritation?

Either way, it's not really all that important, because the dilution factor of the water will help prevent transmission on its own.

[Shiver Me Timbers]

CP stop passing gas.....
https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=330675

[IowaHawkeyeChief]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

https://www.sccgov.org/sites/covid19...ard.aspx#cases

That's a link to the Santa Clara County COVID-19 site.

They're showing 1,833 cases with 69 deaths, so I'm not sure I understand this paper. Is it just an estimate based on ?

The way I read the study is they did random anti-body test and found the results to be around 3% of the population, per the study, this would mean:

These prevalence estimates represent a range between 48,000 and 81,000 people infected in Santa Clara County by early April, 50-85-fold more than the number of confirmed cases. Conclusions The population prevalence of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies in Santa Clara County implies that the infection is much more widespread than indicated by the number of confirmed cases.

[Bugeater]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Aren't most pools closer to 3-5 to avoid irritation?

Either way, it's not really all that important, because the dilution factor of the water will help prevent transmission on its own.

10 is the limit in the State of NE, but yeah, I generally tried to keep mine 4-6 ppm, irritation isn't really a factor if the ph is at the right level. As far as I know, running it higher is just pointlessly using up chemicals. But we're more concerned with germs than viruses. I am curious to see what's going to happen with them come summer, but I'll bet they're simply not going to open.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by KCChiefsFan88

So is that different than “inactivating” the virus as the CDC indicates chlorine will do?

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...php/water.html

We're having two different conversations here:

1) do you need to worry about getting it from pool water? No

2) Would chlorine in water at a concentration of a few ppm inactivate the virus? Quite a bit less likely. The products we use for disinfection of our laminar flow hoods still take a few minutes at much higher concentration (1-2 percent, which is 10,000-20,000 ppm) to exhibit a three log kill of virus.

[Bugeater]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

We're having two different conversations here:

1) do you need to worry about getting it from pool water? No

2) Would chlorine in water at a concentration of a few ppm inactivate the virus? Quite a bit less likely. The products we use for disinfection of our laminar flow hoods still take a few minutes at much higher concentration (1-2 percent, which is 10,000-20,000 ppm) to exhibit a three log kill of virus.

That's serious firepower there.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Bugeater

10 is the limit in the State of NE, but yeah, I generally tried to keep mine 4-6 ppm, irritation isn't really a factor if the ph is at the right level. As far as I know, running it higher is just pointlessly using up chemicals. But we're more concerned with germs than viruses. I am curious to see what's going to happen with them come summer, but I'll bet they're simply not going to open.

Yeah, you're right on. Viruses aren't going to propagate in murky water like bacteria, protists, etc because they don't have a host. Because of that, there isn't really a public health concern from the water, just the proximity of people in the water.

[Bugeater]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Yeah, you're right on. Viruses aren't going to propagate in murky water like bacteria, protists, etc because they don't have a host. Because of that, there isn't really a public health concern from the water, just the proximity of people in the water.

Ah, good to know. I have to renew my license every 2 years, and viruses have never been a topic, although there's never been anything like this going on in the 10 years I've been doing it.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Bugeater

That's serious firepower there.

It would be like diluting bleach in half and using that.

You have no idea.

Spore-forming bacteria are absolute bitches to kill. Seventy percent rubbing alcohol will not kill C-diff (which produces a diarrhea so foul it will clear out a hospital room), so you need special agents to get rid of nasty bugs like it and its brethren. Enter sporicides.

We use one called Peridox RTU that is a combination of hydrogen peroxide and acetic acid, which forms peroxyacetic acid. Imagine the nastiness of vinegar smell mixed with the funkiness of hydrogen peroxide, then spraying it in an enclosed area. It will turn your eyes into faucets, and unless you follow it up with 70% IPA (rubbing alcohol), it will rust out stainless steel.