Cardinals Release WR DeAndre Hopkins [Titans, 2yr/$26 million]

[Dante84]

Interesting

Cardinals released DeAndre Hopkins. pic.twitter.com/c0f9UaabYA

— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) May 26, 2023

[BleedingRed]

Originally Posted by Dante84

Starting to wonder if someone is going to get him on a big discount.

I know a guy

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

Never said the sky is falling or that we aren't great because we don't have a WR1. Or that our offense doesn't have some really interesting prospects to work with.

But people keep pointing to the #1 offense last year as if it's beyond reproach. And the big one continues to be how much we rely on Kelce. And what we look like in rare instances (like Tennessee) where a defense can neutralize him somewhat. Until that WR room materializes, that's gotta be a consideration. There were a few teams that used a formula that worked and you gotta believe defenses particularly in the AFC are building their roster/gameplan around that.

And I'm not bringing the Bengals up to say we can't beat them. But the margin of error is slim and I believe we must do that on offense. I believe in our defensive improvements, but I also believe Allen and Burrow (like Mahomes) can pull together games where even great defenses can only do so much. And given how awful their backup OL was in that playoff game, while our defense is better, I don't think that comes close to how much a healthy OL elevates Burrow. Maybe a healthy offense would've solved our 4th quarter offense vs. Cincy. But we also saw really bad 4th quarter offensive performances vs Rams, Denver, Seattle, Houston and most alarming... Buffalo. It's not like it was a one-off. We won on our own merit, but you can't ignore that we also faced a LOT of really really bad offenses the last half of the year (including Cincy, as an anomaly).

So yeah, I believe we need to adapt. Maybe the improvements we made in the WR room get us there. I just think the WR1 is the last missing link. I just don't know how any defense even on their best day can stop us then.

Let's talk about those games.

1. Buffalo. The Chiefs had 3 possessions in the 4th quarter and had a FG, a 3-and-out, and a 1-play drive that ended on an INT. 1 pt/drive, not good

Healthy Von Miller was significantly impacting that game.

2. Bengals. The Chiefs literally had two possessions in the 4th quarter, coming off opening the second half with back-to-back TD drives. The first ended in the Kelce fumble (when they had just picked up a huge chunk to get to midfield and looked to be in business) and the second was a missed FG (Which was a 55-yard try that came after that sack stopped a good drive). 0 pt/drive, not good. Could easily have been at least 1.5 pt/drive, below average

3. Rams. Holding a 20-10 lead entering the 4th quarter, the Chiefs burned the first six minutes of the quarter and threw an INT on 3rd and goal. Then kicked a FG. Then kicked a FG. 2 pt/drive, average

They were absolutely dominating the Rams, drove the ball to the goalline on the last "real" drive, and the game was never in doubt. Vanilla effort with a big lead against a team that had no chance with the QB it was using.

4. Broncos part 1. Only one TD in the second half, that was a game where the Chiefs led 27-0 at one point, clearly took the foot off the gas, and had a hard time dialing it back in. It happens. The second half did feature a pair of long drives, one that gave the Chiefs a 2-score lead headed into the 4th, and the other to close the game out and not let Denver have the ball back, down a score. 0 pt/drive, not good

5. Broncos part 2. 3 drives. One TD. One punt. One drive that ended on kneel downs after picking up a first down. 3.5 pt/drive, excellent

6. Texans. The offense put up a TD and had a missed FG on its other drive in the 4th quarter. Then punted and scored a TD in OT to win it. Not an offensive issue. 3/5 pt/drive, excellent

The idea that the Chiefs had a consistent track record of performing "terribly" in the 4th quarter of these games is just not in line with reality.

Excluding knee downs, I see 16 drives for 30 points, with two drives that ended in missed FGs, in the 4th quarter of these games. That's 1.875 points per drive, or about a 10th of a point off average for the NFL. Tack on the missed FGs, and you're back into top 10 NFL territory.

And considering that many of these games featured drives where KC had a lead and was focused on killing the clock, that's pretty darn good. Definitely not "terrible."

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by penguinz

Complete bullshit. You are just trying to make it fit your narrative which it doesn't.

All the games have been a field goal difference.

Each of KC's losses has been because they made boneheaded mistakes that were not of any doing by Cincy's D.

KC lost those games vs Cincy winning them.

Lol, I guess “a win is a win” only counts when the Chiefs are on the right side of that aphorism, eh?

Pretty much why I never use that one myself. Same as “we have the best pass-rush in the NFL” - circa 2018 just prior to the AFCCG.

Ditto our “best 3rd down defense” of the same year.

Or any of the half dozen other silly things people say, like “we have the number one offense,” based on a single stat like total yards, while completely ignoring any stat that doesn’t conform to that one metric.

But whatever. I’ve pretty much covered all this multiple times now. Either you can read or you can’t.

[staylor26]

Thanks duncan for taking the time to further prove that zilla is STILL talking out of his ass.

I don't know if there's ever been a thread with a poster saying this much false/stupid shit.

[dlphg9]

Some people in this thread have gone full ****ing reerun. Seriously bitching about our team that won the Super Bowl, because they've become obsessed with an old WR that'll probably play in 10 games this season.

[dlphg9]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

Let's talk about those games.

1. Buffalo. The Chiefs had 3 possessions in the 4th quarter and had a FG, a 3-and-out, and a 1-play drive that ended on an INT.

Healthy Von Miller was significantly impacting that game.

2. Bengals. The Chiefs literally had two possesions in the 4th quarter, coming off opening the second half with back-to-back TD drives. The first ended in the Kelce fumble (when they had just picked up a huge chunk to get to midfield and looked to be in business) and the second was a missed FG (Which was a 55-yard try that came after that sack stopped a good drive).

3. Rams. Holding a 20-10 lead entering the 4th quarter, the Chiefs burned the first six minutes of the quarter and threw an INT on 3rd and goal. Then kicked a FG. Then kicked a FG.

They were absolutely dominating the Rams, drove the ball to the goalline on the last "real" drive, and the game was never in doubt. Vanilla effort with a big lead against a team that had no chance with the QB it was using.

4. Broncos part 1. Only one TD in the second half, that was a game where the Chiefs led 27-0 at one point, clearly took the foot off the gas, and had a hard time dialing it back in. It happens. The second half did feature a pair of long drives, one that gave the Chiefs a 2-score lead headed into the 4th, and the other to close the game out and not let Denver have the ball back, down a score.

5. Broncos part 2. 3 drives. One TD. One punt. One drive that ended on kneel downs after picking up a first down.

6. Texans. The offense put up a TD and had a missed FG on its other drive in the 4th quarter. Then punted and scored a TD in OT to win it. Not an offensive issue.

The idea that the Chiefs had a consistent track record of performing "terribly" in the 4th quarter of these games is just not in line with reality.

Excluding knee downs, I see 16 drives for 30 points, with two drives that ended in missed FGs, in the 4th quarter of these games. That's 1.875 points per drive, or about a 10th of a point off average for the NFL. Tack on the missed FG, and you're back into top 10 NFL territory.

And considering that many of these games featured drives where KC had a lead and was focused on killing the clock, that's pretty darn good. Definitely not "terrible."

This just literally killed a couple of dumbasses. They can't recover from being owned this hard. Thanks Duncan! You rock!

[tredadda]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

Lol, I guess “a win is a win” only counts when the Chiefs are on the right side of that aphorism, eh?

Pretty much why I never use that one myself. Same as “we have the best pass-rush in the NFL” - circa 2018 just prior to the AFCCG.

Ditto our “best 3rd down defense” of the same year.

Or any of the half dozen other silly things people say, like “we have the number one offense,” based on a single stat like total yards, while completely ignoring any stat that doesn’t conform to that one metric.

But whatever. I’ve pretty much covered all this multiple times now. Either you can read or you can’t.

They also led the league in scoring last year, does that count?

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by dlphg9

Some people in this thread have gone full ****ing reerun. Seriously bitching about our team that won the Super Bowl, because they've become obsessed with an old WR that'll probably play in 10 games this season.

I don't really think anyone is obsessed to be honest. I think it just comes down to that people would like to think we are far and away the best team and well that move probably does that going into the year.

[duncan_idaho]

Originally Posted by Mecca

I don't really think anyone is obsessed to be honest. I think it just comes down to that people would like to think we are far and away the best team and well that move probably does that going into the year.

I kind of get that. I think this team, plus a healthy and still 85-90 percent of his prime DeAndre Hopkins, would be a serious contender to go 20-0.

But I think this team, without that Hopkins, is still a serious contender to go 20-0.

[smithandrew051]

From what I’ve read here, this is a win win situation.

If we sign Hopkins, we’re likely going undefeated.

If we don’t, then we likely get the number 1 pick so we can grab Marvin Harrison Jr.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

I kind of get that. I think this team, plus a healthy and still 85-90 percent of his prime DeAndre Hopkins, would be a serious contender to go 20-0.

But I think this team, without that Hopkins, is still a serious contender to go 20-0.

We're the favorite either way, this would just add a bit of distance.

I personally also want to see the rest of the fans whine about how unfair this is.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

Let's talk about those games.

1. Buffalo. The Chiefs had 3 possessions in the 4th quarter and had a FG, a 3-and-out, and a 1-play drive that ended on an INT.

Healthy Von Miller was significantly impacting that game.

2. Bengals. The Chiefs literally had two possesions in the 4th quarter, coming off opening the second half with back-to-back TD drives. The first ended in the Kelce fumble (when they had just picked up a huge chunk to get to midfield and looked to be in business) and the second was a missed FG (Which was a 55-yard try that came after that sack stopped a good drive).

3. Rams. Holding a 20-10 lead entering the 4th quarter, the Chiefs burned the first six minutes of the quarter and threw an INT on 3rd and goal. Then kicked a FG. Then kicked a FG.

They were absolutely dominating the Rams, drove the ball to the goalline on the last "real" drive, and the game was never in doubt. Vanilla effort with a big lead against a team that had no chance with the QB it was using.

4. Broncos part 1. Only one TD in the second half, that was a game where the Chiefs led 27-0 at one point, clearly took the foot off the gas, and had a hard time dialing it back in. It happens. The second half did feature a pair of long drives, one that gave the Chiefs a 2-score lead headed into the 4th, and the other to close the game out and not let Denver have the ball back, down a score.

5. Broncos part 2. 3 drives. One TD. One punt. One drive that ended on kneel downs after picking up a first down.

6. Texans. The offense put up a TD and had a missed FG on its other drive in the 4th quarter. Then punted and scored a TD in OT to win it. Not an offensive issue.

The idea that the Chiefs had a consistent track record of performing "terribly" in the 4th quarter of these games is just not in line with reality.

Excluding knee downs, I see 16 drives for 30 points, with two drives that ended in missed FGs, in the 4th quarter of these games. That's 1.875 points per drive, or about a 10th of a point off average for the NFL. Tack on the missed FG, and you're back into top 10 NFL territory.

And considering that many of these games featured drives where KC had a lead and was focused on killing the clock, that's pretty darn good. Definitely not "terrible."

I don't count the regular season bengals game. Our offense was great aside from a Kelce fumble. And I didn't say we have a history of performing terribly. Just that our offense wasn't as dominant in the second half of the season as we remember.

Buffalo 4Q was terrible
Rams 4Q was terrible- we were bailed out by 2 INTs from their 20th string QB
Colts 4Q was terrible
Seattle 4Q was terrible (arguably because of weather)
Denver 2nd half 4Q was terrible (can use big lead as an excuse)
Tennesse 2nd half was terrible (off-paper) - bailed out by horrendous QB play by Willis
LAC game 1 wasn't ideal - bailed out by Herbert completely shitting his pants
Houston 4Q wasn't great, but I'll give you it wasn't terrible
Cincy playoff 4Q wasn't great (can use injuries as an excuse)

It's no reason to panic. But if you actually play these games back, especially the first 6, they were games where we were flat out stuck on offense. And arguably a lot of these defenses are doing it in a similar way that you'd have to think we'll see more of in 2023. I just think we need to adapt more than we think. Maybe our WR corps can do it. I'd just like to have some insurance on it.

[tredadda]

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

I kind of get that. I think this team, plus a healthy and still 85-90 percent of his prime DeAndre Hopkins, would be a serious contender to go 20-0.

But I think this team, without that Hopkins, is still a serious contender to go 20-0.

Heads would explode if they did not sign Hopkins and still did that. They would have done it by drafting well and signing good, yet under the radar FAs.

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by tredadda

They also led the league in scoring last year, does that count?

Yeah you can throw that in there with the other far too general declarations people like to use far too frequently. Good catch.

[tredadda]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

Yeah you can throw that in there with the other far too general declarations people like to use far too frequently. Good catch.

What would you need to see to judge whether an offense is #1 in the league or not?