Advanced metrics are fun. Let's see production.

That's because usually you don't have nothing but young guys unless you are a rebuilding team.

I'm not worked up because he went somewhere where he doesn't matter.

:facepalm:

I don't know if that was true or not but I don't think DHop not signing with the Chiefs makes what this guy said false. Maybe the Chiefs did try to sign him. Maybe they threw everything they could at him that didn't include more money. Maybe DHop just wanted the most money he could get while still playing for what he felt was a playoff team. Of course, this will most likely end in disappointment for him. LMAO

Defector headline: DeAndre Hopkins Willingly Agrees To Catch The Rare Titans Pass

He went for the most money, which is honestly what 99% of guys do. He tried to get the Chiefs and Bills to playball and it just didn't happen, at least not at the money he wanted.

But him going to a team that is probably at best 8th in the AFC makes him largely a non factor.

Apparently the Titans are considered one of the worst teams in the league of you look at betting odds.

Yea and then there's this contingent of people even among ones that cover the NFL saying the Titans are "the most slept on team" it's weird how so many think they are still good.

Didn't Hardman miss over half the season? :spock:

Yup. Like 8 games and basicly all of the playoffs.

He took awhile to get learn to play NFL WR in Reid's system. But to use the fumbles stats against him is a little dishonest considering those weren't even when he was playing WR. :shake:

Why are we still posting in this thread? Close it and lock it until we revisit it in two years when this turd fizzles out of the league after winning exactly 0 playoff games in Tennessee. Then we can all talk about what a useless shithead he is.

With the high paid profile guys we have on the OL, QB, DL etc they've gotta get cheap draft pick production somewhere.

Seems Andy has been able to do it thru his career at WR so it doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

The Chiefs basically are a rebuilding at WR team.

I wouldn't say I'm worried per se, but I think most people would point to the WR group as being the team's weakness until proven otherwise.

Yea and SB contenders generally don't do that.

Unproven, for sure.

A weakness? I dunno. With Mahomes at QB and Andy at HC.....seems like it should work out pretty well. I don't know how we can see it as less than last year and that worked out fine?

They rebuilt at OL, were a contender

Rebuilt at WR, were a contender, won a SB.

Rebuilt the secondary, were a contender, won a SB.

I guess I'm not really getting the issue.

Meh. We'll be fine. MVS and Toney have already proven to be able to step up and ball out when it's their time, and Moore and Rice both will grow into their respective roles.

Even those positional rebuilds were generally centered around 1 or 2 guys that were reliable enough to get through.

The rebuilt OL featured Joe Thuney who's probably the best guard in the league and OT's that weren't rookies even if you hated them.

The secondary featured a 1st round pick, a safety room with experience and Sneed.

Last year's WR room had JuJu to at least be a consistent presence for the most part.

I'm not saying the position will sink the team but the biggest thing it lacks are just a consistent presence. MVS has never been that, Toney can't stay on the field so then we are to a bunch of guys that just have never done it.

We're not going to fall off a cliff, but it's a very CP thing to be overly optimistic about draft picks.

We need someone who can move chains in critical situations like JuJu could. He wasn't completely healthy last year but you look at some of our close games, the SB, Texans game, Titans, later in the season against the Donks - those were his best games. A critical first down changes the outcome a lot of weeks in the NFL.

We don't really have anyone who can definitely fill that role, and we need to replace ~80 receptions and ~1000 yards. The main concern with the team this year might be how we're going to do that.

MVS is MVS he'll have 1-3 games where he has a big game and then the rest of the games he'll be largely invisible with a catch here and there, that is his entire career.

Toney I'll believe he'll stay healthy when he does, talent is there but he's legit always hurt.

Start praying that Skyy Moore is ready to be a somebody and Richie James is more than a punt returner.

Agreed. Would have been fun to have him and think about the possibilities but as long as he didn't go to a contender I'm ok with it.

The combination of Moore and Rice will be more than sufficient in filling that role.

Do we actually believe Rashee Rice is going to see the field very much?

Yes?

"Dollar signs." No surprise. At least Nuk will be able to watch the Super Bowl in a well furnished home theater.

Well I hope so...

A little more than Moore did last year.

JJSS is a fungible player and if Skyy Moore can't fill that role we have bigger issues.

JJSS was at the very least a proven reliable NFL commodity.

I think that the Kansas City Chiefs, my favorite team, are poised to make a run at another title!

There was no way KC would have ever been in on something like that. I'd rafter extend Jones and Sneed

Pretty amazing that people act like it's a stretch to think we can replace JSS with one or some combination of Moore, James, and Rice.

Richie James is a veteran and had like 60 catches and 7-8 TD's last year with Daniel ****ing Jones.

Yeah, it's puzzling.

So much handwringing over replacing JJSS and Hardman w/ Rice and James.

That's it - that's all we've done. And Hardman missed most of last season (and was a whipping boy when he was in there). JJSS didn't DO anything but run 5 yard routes and stand in space.

"JJSS was reliable..." No he wasn't. He was a known quantity and part of what was known was that he is NOT reliable due to a chronic knee issue. The one thing we reliably know about JJSS is that he can be relied on not to ever beat man coverage. His greatest contribution there was drawing a holding call because Andy deked the hell out of Bradberry with those route combinations.

I just don't see any loss there. And there's plenty of room for improvement - even from guys like James (a veteran in a similar system last season in NYG) and MVS, who was SO close to being a massive weapon for us so many times. Oh, and who had the game of his life in the AFCCG.

Not sceered.

Do SB contenders generally trade their stud WR1 and win a SB with stop gaps?

Should've known you'd be a drama queen after missing out on Hopkins.

Right? When did Richie James turn into some POS bit of roster fodder? Guy has a really nice season last year with a QB who simply can't throw it where he aims. He gets outstanding separation and has plenty of NFL experience. The tools are there for him to be quite good and if he's nothing BUT who he was last season, he's still awfully valuable.

Went to the team that wrote him the largest check. Once he was slow-playing FA, it was clear what he was doing.

Moving on...

He signed a roster fodder contract so that's what happens.

No one's being a drama queen, it's a perfectly reasonable conversation to say the WR room has questions everywhere.

Okay? Why is that an indictment on him? If anything that's a pat on the back for Veach getting a quality contributor at that price point.

Always a good idea to decide on a player's utility via the size of his paycheck...

JJSS put up 200 ish more yards than Richie James last year on 24 more receptions. I'd say James is proven enough.

At least he's not on the Bills or on a real rival team.

And James actually found the end zone. For all this talk about how 'reliable' JJSS was, he got in 3 times all season. That's actually pretty lousy for the #1 guy.

That's how it gets perceived, it's why a bunch of people think Watson will make the team.

Every team has questions. Ours has fewer than most, if not ALL of them.

And the one area where we have the most questions A) Has some really nice possible answers and B) Is the area on this team that the baddest man on the planet can do the most to help out.

It's a cap league - teams are SUPPOSED to have questions. But we're not appreciably worse off than we were a year ago when won the 'ship.

Out of curiosity if they are that close why did one get a pretty substantial contract and the other get next to nothing, it's a fair question I think.

And I'm not saying it won't largely be a non issue or anything like that, just on paper going into the year we probably come in at like 26 or 27 at WR in the league currently.

Sure, Jan.

James is only a PR.

Can't project a big year 2 jump for Moore.

Rice won't play, even though everybody else is unreliable or shit.

Yes, KC is still a contender. But isn't much of a margin or a lot of guarantees in the NFL.

If Toney is spending a lot if time injured, that can put more pressure on Kelce to stay in the game when you would rather see him do more load management.

Can Mahomes win with basically JAGs at WR. Yes, but he also takes more hits in order to do so and again the margin for winning gets reduced.

Sure, these are great problems to have compared to 31 other NFL teams.

But I rather suspect that Toney's health for the post season is going to be big, big, story line for a very good reason.

Ah, what am saying? Of course KC will just waltz into another SB appearance...

Think we're positioned quite well comparatively to this point last year.

lol, I'll probably just enjoy the season and watching them contend for another AFCCG appearance like they have every year Mahomes has started..... despite bad defense, or a bad offensive line, or more bad defense, or a few weeks where everything went wrong, or no Tyreek, or high ankle sprains, or the NFL being against the Chiefs at every turn, or....

I don't know how this isn't the consensus.

It's a young group, but much more talented and more depth, along with Toney and Moore being in year 2.

"Start praying" but he isn't being a drama Queen :rolleyes:

Yep. So I went and looked up his stats for last season and I overstated his TD's but he had 57 receptions (70 targets) and 4 TD's. He was the Giants leading WR though in both of those categories. He also had a QB that was middle of the pack in attempts (472) compared to Mahomes 648.

I mean, I prefer to maximize production per unit of salary cap allocation.

Some guys/gals think expensive is automatically better, tho.

I'm talking the whole team. Mahomes and Kelce are Mahomes and Kelce, the WR room is kind of a wash at this point and has the potential to be a pleasant surprise ala the rookie CBs last season, the OL should be improved if Donovan Smith proves last year was a fluke, the DL got DEMONSTRABLY better with the addition of Omenihu/subtraction of Clark, and the back end gets another collective year of experience.

God damn it's a reasonable ****ing debate, it doesn't mean the team sucks. You can believe they'll be good the same as it can be questioned because well it's an unproven room.

LMAO You're the one who started the post with 'start praying'. That's a pretty wild opening salvo when your argument is 'the WR room is relatively unproven'.

"Start praying" isn't reasonable debate.

James is nothing more than a PR isn't reasonable debate.

James is only as good as the contract we gave him isn't reasonable debate.

Automatically assuming Rice doesn't contribute much isn't reasonable debate.

You're being a drama queen whether you want to acknowledge it or not :shrug:

No one here has said the sky is falling or that the team is taking a step backward from being contenders.

We're just discussing a WR group that will collectively be asked to be a lot bigger contributors than they've ever been on an NFL team before, and if there's anyone on the roster who could be a #1 receiver in the NFL.

If anything the dramatic behavior is coming from the people who are shocked that anyone might have questions about it.

Ok that was slightly over the top other than if you should pray for Toney to stay healthy, I'll lay it on that one.

Skyy Moore should be able to be a solid starter at this point. But again you're expecting something he hasn't shown you when you think that.

I really hope Rice doesn't get the Reid rookie WR treatment. They need to play him early on.

SO IT TURNS OUT THAT THIS GUY IS TRULY A GIGANTIC PIECE OF SHIT!!!!

That's a myth. Maclin and Jackson both got a huge amount of work as rookies. Hardman was behind Hill, Kelce, and Watkins at the very least for touches and Moore had his confidence cratered being thrown out on PR duty when he was wholly unsuited for it.

Because the Chiefs in the tenure of Andy Reid have generally not gotten big contributes out of rookie WR's. We had a questionable room last year and Skyy Moore didn't really do a whole lot.

Richie James is what he is, basically every team in the league has a guy like that, he's not gonna go out there and be a top 2 WR.

From WR 3-7 the Chiefs are pretty good lotta a depth but 1 and 2 is where the issue lays for the most part.

And one had Patrick Mahomes throwing to him and the other had Daniel Jones throwing to him.

When you have arguably the greatest offensive coach in NFL history combined with arguably the most talented QB to ever play, well you're gonna be able to cut corners and make a lot of shit work.

This isn't Alex Smith. We have an unbelievable disparity when it comes to everyone else. We're graded on a curve.

Don't believe me? Look at Josh Allen and how he's struggled to push through. Look at Joe Burrow being carried by his team having zero 4th quarter playoff TD's or TD drives.

Our risk tolerance is on a whole other level and last year was full proof of that. Mahomes is that much better than everyone else.

Andy Reid is too good of an offensive mind, and Mahomes is too good of a QB, for all the young talent in that WR room to disappoint.

I'm just not concerned even though I have no issue acknowledging that the WR room is unproven today.

Jackson mainly got to start because of injuries. They made a big deal at the time that he was the first rookie to be an opening day starter for Andy Reid, after he'd been there like 10 years.

But those guys were better prospects as well, Jackson had truly elite speed and was a plus kick returner. Maclin was a much higher level prospect and might have been a top 10 pick before he was injured at the combine IIRC.

Yip

THERE WAS NEVER A DOUBT!!!!

Andy Reid was producing a top offense with Donovan McNabb throwing to Freddie Mitchell, Todd Pinkston, Greg Lewis and James Thrash.

It's crazy that people forget this. Andy is that ****ing good man

Some of us caught on to this sooner than others…..

Anyone done a wellness check on MegaMoron??

I don't think the team is going to suck, the issue is with the other top teams your margins are razor thin, that's all.