Luciano isn't universal top 20 anymore. His stock has plummeted. Baseball America has him down to No. 33 on its latest update and Fangraphs' Ryan Langenhagen has him on the backend of his top 100 the last I checked.

Because you sell now on that one....trust me

Walker is going to come down to swing plane. If he doesn't start adding loft, he's Ke'Bryan Hayes without defensive value. Maybe if you're lucky he becomes Yelich (but not the MVP year Yelich where he had a 13 degree LA vs every other season of his career being at/below half that).

Walk absolutely has to get the ball in the air. He's just not getting enough out of his raw power and so that's going to impact how teams pitch to him and thus his OBP as well.

Then again, he's so damn young that there's plenty of time. And Gorman was a baby when he made his debut as well and it took a season or so to firm things up.

Short answer is that I don't give up either for a rental. Not with this ownership group unwilling to go into the market and win.

'Bout time.

He hasn't done anything in 3-4 years to demonstrate that he's even a real top 100 guy, let alone top 20.

He's not developed a bit for SF.

There's nothing about what Nootbar's currently doing that seems to be unsustainable.

Which is why I think trading TON or DeJong for a rental (though he's going to outproduce his contract but holy shit he's so ****ing inconsistent offensively). I like TON, but I can't see there being room for him in the OF if they insist on keeping Carlson along with Burleson/Yepez (which one of them should be moved as well for a reliever).

Offense is finally producing as we expected but the rotation is still a dumpster fire. Bullpen is worse than I envisioned, though.

I want Winn up so bad, but until he shows he can hit minor league pitching consistently, there's no need to rush him.

Complete aside, I think Edman might be my favorite player on the team.

They pitched Liberatore out of the bullpen but keep trotting Matz out there to get completely shelled.

There is absolutely no baseball reason to continue pitching Matz over Liberatore. Dumbshit Mo doesn’t want to look bad, or even worse because of Matz overpay.

ROFL "we'll see"

There is no way we are getting a quality starting pitcher without trading either Gorman, Walker and or Winn, correct?

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Clutch in crunch time. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/STLCards?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#STLCards</a> <a href="https://t.co/N8VJ1sqACo">pic.twitter.com/N8VJ1sqACo</a></p>&mdash; Bally Sports Midwest (@BallySportsMW) <a href="https://twitter.com/BallySportsMW/status/1661816705134239755?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 25, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

We all know thewy aren't trading for a quality starter, it's just not in this club's plans. If they were going to trade any of them it should be Walker. He stinks in the outfield and has no clear path to the big club if he's not in the outfield.

Gorman is untouchable. Deal you know who

I'd really prefer them not make any trades.

John Mozeliak's ability to scout his own players is so goddamn bad that he's essentially a sitting duck in these conversations. He has no earthly idea who can actually play at this level so when he's making deals, other teams are just picking his pocket.

Fortunately he finally appears to realize this so he's simply unwilling to deal.

If we're hell-bent on keeping this pile of shit, doing nothing is the best we can do.

The odds of us getting anyone notably better than Graceffo or McGreevy are pretty long unless someone like the Giants falls out of it and are willing to deal Cobb. But ultimately, the Cardinals have more reasons to be sellers than the Giants do. When you start to look for teams that may sell veteran SPs, most of those teams are BETTER situated than STL is.

Its really weird that the Arenado and Goldy trades have been his best. But.... thats not the whole story. We got the better part of those deals because of the incompeteance of the other teams, not Mo's GM expertise.

Even if you are a terrible poker player sometimes you find two fish even bigger than you. Nevertheless, you're still prey to everyone else in the pond.

FWIW, Goldschmidt's bat is showing serious signs of slowing down this year. They need to have a conversation about dealing him while he still has some value.