That list is referring to the other Wilson, "Roman" from Michigan. Sorry for not including first names in the second half.

Where do you think Jonny Wilson stacks up as a TE in this year's class?

ESPN's rankings btw

1. Brock Bowers, Georgia (#3 overall)
2. Ja'Tavion Sanders, Texas
3. Cade Stover, Ohio State
4. Theo Johnson, Penn State
5. Luke Lachey, Iowa

Really wish they would have put Theo Johnson down a couple notches. Kind of liked him being somewhat of an unknown still. Not even looking at Bowers. Like Lachey, would like to see how well he tests after recovering from the broken ankle.

Lot's of available WRs in the offseason too: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-age...ide-receiver//

ESPN is also predicting the following names will become available: Cooper, K. Allen or M. Wiliams, Aiuk, & Lockett.

Adams, Hopkins, PIT WRs, and others may also want out of their current rosters.

Might only need to grab 1 WR in the draft + 1 vet WR.

Yeah I think he's a Hyatt type. Good long speed but hs 40 not that impressive. Not sure I like him him. He just seems a bit, rigid.

You honestly think ESPN rankings somehow uncover an unknown steal that scouting departments don’t know about? Like, you and Veach are the only ones that are aware of this prospect? Am I reading this right?

You just decided to jump both feet off the assumption bus today.

I'm saying that a media outlet like ESPN with it's reach putting him in their top 5, when he has been ranging in the top 15-20 of TE prospects can raise his exposure. I don't know what Veach thinks, don't care to either. I was merely trying to point out it sure would be nice for ESPN to keep him in that top 15-20 range, rather than top 5.

What impact do you think ESPN putting a player in the top five has on NFL scouting departments?

Why don't you tell me since you seem to give a damn so much?

I don't care what a NFL scouting dept. does. You are just trying to start an argument where there doesn't need to be one.

So many of this year's WRs are 6'3 or taller!

Roman Wilson in the top 10 WRs? That's rich. He's a very linear athlete and doesn't really do alot of damage outside of downfield plays. He's like a smaller version of MVS to me... Anyhow...

Jonny Wilson, it kind of depends on 1) does he have the mindset that he has to be a WR or would he be willing to play TE and 2) how is his blocking? I don't really know those answers all that well. Based on what I do know, probably would fit in behind Bowers and Sanders for me as a late 2 guy.

One guy I really like is Gavin Bartholomew out of Pitt but I wonder if he'd declare as a Junior. Not many Pitt guys leave early. If he does, he'd be the guy I'd pound the table for in the 3rd because of age and package of abilities.

I really wish Bryson Nesbit had a thicker frame. He may not declare either though Maye leaving could push him to go.

I love Stover but I wonder if age will be a factor for Veach with him.

I also like Yurosek a bunch but he's another Junior and he's having an a bit of a down year so we'll see what he does. More of a Noah Gray type.

Nabers is the guy I'd like.

But just no chance he gets to us.

I liked Brevyn Spann-Ford last year:

"TE Brevyn Span Ford, Minnesota, 6-7 254 lbs

Holy shit! This guy lives to plow linebackers! I saw him referred to as a "3rd Tackle out there." But he doesn't just truck mother ****ers all day, this guys got serious hands too! "Soft hands" even, and a "playmaker." His highlight real starts with a pretty amazing circus catch for a guy his size, another real I watched highlighted him as a big hitter demolishing LBs. At 6-7 with ~500 yards I'm guessing he'd make a great Red Zone target, or at least he'd move a guy or two out of the way for Pacheco! I've seen him going as high as the 3rd, ranked as a top 10 TE, but others like ESPN doesn't even rank him."

I see a lot of folks mocking Adanai Mitchell to us, thoughts?

SCOUTING REPORT: STRENGTHS
Elite "catch radius" with a formidable blend of frame and wingspan; capitalizes on mismatches, especially in red-zone situations.
"High-point" specialist with unmatched vertical prowess; his stride frequency paired with long strides translates to undeniable deep-ball threat capability.
Dynamic "RAC" (Run After Catch) asset; exhibits short-area burst and twitch, making him a nightmare for defenders in open space.
Elite athletic skills -- Made Bruce Feldman's 2023 'Freaks List' at number 28. He wrote: "At almost 6 feet 7, 239 pounds, he has 36-inch arms, 10 1/4 inch hands and a standing reach of 8-10. He also has a 35.5 inch vertical and a 10-5 broad jump. In games, he’s topped out at 21.23 MPH with a max acceleration of 5.26 m/s and has a max deceleration of -7.21 m/s."
Balances like a "bell-cow back"; his contact balance and drive consistently see him power through arm tackles and churn extra yards.
Master of the aerial game; whether stretching the field or toe-tapping on the sideline, he shows elite spatial awareness and ball skills.
"Contested-catch" maestro; his ability to adjust mid-air, combined with his frame, makes him the go-to target on 50/50 balls.
Deceptive and agile at stem breaks; uses his overwhelming length to shed press coverage and create windows of separation.
Relentless in the blocking game; harnesses his physical gifts with an understanding of leverage, often pancaking DBs to spring big plays.

Sounds good.

Ja'Lynn Polk keeps climbing up the boards. Looking like a solid day 2 prospect right now.

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Another WR not mentioned much around here is Tre Harris. Great size, speed and route running. Probable day 3 guy.

<iframe width="404" height="718" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/hDyMzMtDu8I" title="Tre Harris is one of the biggest sleepers in the 2024 NFL Draft I CFB Week 10 Winners of the Week" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Ainias Smith. Twitchy fella that would work well on ST day 1.

<iframe width="404" height="718" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Rqjk3DtQuiw" title="Ainias Smith... I don&#39;t even have words for that first juke #shorts" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Those twitchy fellas, most of the time, end up injury-riddled in the NFL. I try not to get too caught up with it.

I never seem to learn my lesson with linear speed though, for whatever reason.

Acceleration, enough agility to create crisp route breaks, and hands... that seems to always be a winning combination. I'll be damned if I don't lose sight of it constantly though. Precisely the reason I think Emeka Egbuka is going to be an absolute stud but can he get within our range to move up...

His knees are gonna explode.

His knees and achilles are gonna explode.

ESPN Draft Risers:

Ja'Lynn Polk, WR, Washington

Polk didn't make my initial scouting list this season, but the fourth-year redshirt sophomore is a physical, aggressive wideout at 6-foot-2 and 204 pounds. He bounces off contact and consistently runs through tacklers. He has 51 catches for 888 yards this season, and after catching his eighth TD on Saturday against USC, Polk will now crack my top 75.

Roman Wilson, WR, Michigan

Wilson was a big mover for me when I put together my recent top 50 board (No. 49), and he justified it on Saturday with a nine-catch, 143-yard day against Purdue. Wilson has been red-hot this season (10 touchdowns), and it's easy to fall in love with his burst and elite speed as a vertical route runner at 6 feet and 192 pounds. He looks like a lock to be a second-round draft choice.

Notes:

• Texas' Xavier Worthy is mentioned often as a late first-rounder, and the junior wideout is one of the most improved players I've seen this season. After a sophomore campaign that saw him drop 10 passes and catch just 52.6% of his targets over 13 games, Worthy boosted those numbers in 2023 -- he has five drops this season, and his reception rate is 64.5%. His effort is noticeably better on tape this year, and Worthy has a chance to enter the top 20 for teams needing a vertical receiver thanks to his speed and burst.

• In yet another strong wide receiver class, two stand out as guys who could go much higher than expected: Xavier Legette (South Carolina) and Adonai Mitchell (Texas). Mitchell has been a touchdown and first-down machine, as 83.8% of his catches this season have resulted in a score or moving the sticks. He hauled in eight catches for 149 yards and a touchdown against K-State. And Legette pieced together another dominant performance, catching nine passes for 217 yards and two touchdowns against Jacksonville State. He is now sixth in receiving this season with 973 yards.

https://x.com/JoeMacheca/status/1706...914816962?s=20

22.3 mph at 6’3” 227 lbs

Damn!

I like Legette. Feels like we always go for a T Lockett type, but I'd love to have a DK Metcalf type in KC. kelce, Legette, Rice is a pretty tough trio to defend over the middle.

I'll take 2!

He is too much of a long strider. Not twitchy in his route running. I wouldn’t hate the pick but he wouldn’t be my first pick for where we pick. I like Worthy and Franklin better

I have to agree after seeing this...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/QNI1aL8uYXI?si=a5MltfAwBI9U50ba" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Feels like it might be the following guys within range our our 1st - 2nd picks:

Egbuka
Koleman
Worthy
Legette
Mitchell
Franklin
J. Wilson
Polk
Corley
R. Wilson

Who are these guys pro-comparisons?

It's football. Any one can be oft-injured. I certainly wouldn't let that hesitate me evaluating what we see in videos or let myself come to some medical nexus without a proper medical exam. We can only watch videos which don't allow us to come to that type of nexus on his health. That would be silly to even try to make that assumption. His skillset is unique enough to warrant an evaluation from us here at CP without making an assumption of a medical nexus.

I like Egbuka, maybe not as much as you. We probably won't have a chance for him though. Never know he may test poorly and drop to the lower 1st. I'm not sure we have the draft capital to move up.

Tank looking pretty solid this year, glad for him.

Using a word like nexus, you should understand then that type II muscle fibers are more prone to fatigue than type I. The twitchier athletes tend to have a higher concentration of type II fibers. Muscle fatigue makes an athlete more susceptible to injuries because those fibers cannot reach the same level of stretch/elasticity that they had when not fatigued. So yes, there is an absolute "medical nexus."

That said, I'm not saying you dismiss a player because of it. I am saying you shouldn't put a premium on an overly twitchy player. It does make for fun highlight videos though.

Our "twitchy" guy Toney is always hurt.

Chiefs will draft Troy Franklin in the first round. Even if they have to move up a few spots. Pro comparison: Calvin Ridley.

Then you should know that type 2 muscle fibers are predominantly in the arms and chest, and type 1 muscle fibers are predominantly in the legs, spine and neck. Unless you are suggesting he will be running on his hands I'm still not sure how you have come to a medical opinion that he will be an injury problem. It's not like he doesn't have all his knee ligaments or anything.

Who is putting on a premium? Last I looked the guy is a day 3, round 5-7 guy. You talk about a top 15-20 guy we more than likely won't have a chance in hell of getting as some sort of barometer. I am just trying to put a guy out there that we might actually have a chance to draft. We have only what, 8 picks this year? Unless someone is traded and some draft capital is gained, I wouldn't expect any trading up imo.

So you're saying there is a need then?

Not especially true, and especially in the context of training. It has been shown that specific athletic training changes muscle fiber structure and the amount of fibers depending on the type. Slow resistance training will increase IIa fibers, fast resistance will increase IIx, sprinting will increase IIx, and endurance will increase I, etc.

Thank you for your medical opinion. You're assumption is that players with a skillset that makes sharp cuts and change of direction is more prone to injury. Of course that a generalization, rather than based on any individual player. At least it didn't stop you last year from liking Tyjae Spears who has that same ability, with a missing knee ligament no less.

I'm however going to refrain on making those type of conclusions on players I can't ever be privy to a medical exam on.

I'm over the "twitchy" or this or that.

They need a big time outside WR. Be that whoever it is.

Michael Thomas coming out of Ohio State was the first time I recall seeing a guy in the draft I just thought was 'smooth' and couldn't figure out why so many people were sleeping on him.

He just didn't lose anything in and out of his cuts. Had good size (not huge, not small) and just did things gracefully. THAT'S what I want this year. Well that or just hot, nasty, badass speed.

But yeah, at this point 'fast in a phonebooth' is a bonus more than something I'm looking at first.

Anyone on this list from 3-8 is on the board when we pick, run up there and take one.

I need to do more homework on Legette. He got hurt in the Mizzou game so I haven't seen him much.

I mean, kid's gonna be 23 when he's drafted. And he didn't do ANYTHING for the first 4 years of his college career. I mean absolutely dick. 42 catches for 400 yards. Not an average, but TOTAL. His first 3 individual seasons are essentially per game averages for his 2023 season.

It's not a deal breaker, but those are red flags. That's really really odd.

Yeah, it's weird. I also wonder what his rebuttal/story is around the lack of production until this year? Did the dude wait until his last year to get juiced up so he'd look like a phenom for his last shot at the league, or what?

Right.

I mean why doesn't the "Contract Year Remains Undefeated" logic apply here? It was clearly his platform season and his only shot at the league.

What changed THAT much for him? Just seems to be worth a little more digging into. And what would be most demonstrative is actually his tape from previous seasons. Is he that much different or just being used differently? Is his production volume based or genuine improvements in skill? If so, what are those improvements and how did they just appear at 22? Is he just a man beating up boys?

Like I said - can't disregard his performance this year. But I'm curious...

My assumption doesn't, my education does. Anyhow, moving on.

Dr Crow, I presume.

Negative. Not that advanced but enough to not be spitting bullshit. One of my undergrad majors was in physical education which had courses in exercise physiology, kinesiology, biomechanics, and sports injuries. My best friend through it was a medical biology major. She went on to do chiropractic while I decided to waste that and my math major and went on to get a master's in accounting and financial management.

I dunno. Chiropractors seem like an awful waste of oxygen and money. Its like playing russian roulette.

She makes a lot more money than I do haha. She's also certified to do it on animals, so she's always getting out of the office to adjust horses and shit. Kinda neat.

Like Crow I like Egbuka quite a bit but doubt he makes it to us. Like DJ I'm undecided on Legette. Plus size he looks big and fast. Once he's rolling he's a YAC monster. Also looks like he has good body control and is pretty damn good at contested catches. That SHOULD be a helluva combination, but something seems off. I think he just feels a bit rigid. I also expected him to be better against press. He's big but I don't think it's an A J Brown big. He's not bullying people all through the route.

Dunno, he just doesn't look "crisp". But again, I'm 100% wrong on WRs so imagine he'll be amazing.

Give me Franklin

Going back-to-back with a couple of these guys might not be the worst thing. Coleman and Franklin to go along with Rice for the next few seasons wouldn't be a bad thing.

Coleman highlights:

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Noy3jqnJlOs" title="Keon Coleman 🔥 Mid-Season Highlights ᴴᴰ" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Franklin highlights:

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/0Xh0D963l8U" title="Troy Franklin 🔥 Most Elite WR in College Football ᴴᴰ" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Would you prefer any of the guys we've listed as 1st and 2nd rounders over some of the available FA's? Forget the Cap.

Egbuka
Coleman
Worthy
Legette
Mitchell
Franklin
J. Wilson
Polk
Corley
R. Wilson

For instance... Evans, Ridley, Higgins, Pittman, Brown, *Hopkins? ...I wonder about Ridley, especially, is there any chance? Where does he stack up compared to these 1st rounders.

It's hard to argue against many of the FAs as they are all proven, 1k WRs in the NFL. Brown, Higgins, and Pittman are guys who wouldn't turn 30 until the very end of a deal, so probably the most attractive. Ridley is 28 already and the others are over 30.

I'm probably not as high on Brown as the rest though. I think Ridley is the type of receiver that best fits a Reid offense. Price/length would be everything there. He'd be a quality first option as a free agent, in my opinion.

At the end of the day, I think I'd prefer Egbuka overall but that might be wishful thinking. So long as Veach adds value in some way, no matter if he plays the draft for DL/OL and FA for WR or some other mix.

The issue is, if we pay Chris Jones, there won't be any 1k FA WR pick-up. You just can't.

Now, if you let Jones walk, you get a 3rd comp. That's not much return. If you tag him again with a try to trade him, it ties the money up. If you tag him and play him, it means no big FA spending.

You've got a lot of guys up for FA. Some you're going to let go, some you're going to pay. There's just not going to be a lot of money.

I'm afraid we're going to have to grow our own here.

LOL

Apparently I'm the thread killer. I'm just going to not talk about anything WR related on the board anymore.

I'm right there with you on growing our own. I don't know if you watched the two highlights I posted, but Coleman and Franklin make some serious contested catches. I'm guessing they aren't always covered, but our offense seems to require guys who can make contested catches. Those two guys seem to be able to do just that. And have some wheels to go with that skill.

Look for guys that separate, not contested catch guys

They’ve whiffed at wr with Toney and moore so they’re gonna have to go pay for some talent

I think you're probably right, we've already seen its difficult to attract top WR talent with what we can offer, which WRs do you like in the draft?

I think these guys can seperate. They can make contested catches too!

I like Franklin and Worthy.

But I haven't gotten into much college ball this year, or seen mocks to guesstimate when guys might go.

I have seen a lot of chatter that this is a really good draft for WR's, QB's, and OT's, though.

We need two of the three.

I haven't looked - how many FA's do we have coming up this year?

They'll tag and trade Jones.

I don't know that going and paying a FA WR makes sense, the ones that are gonna hit the market are older.

I'd guess they go draft one high or trade a pick and pay one.

There are some younger ones available. Higgins and Pittman will both command a lot of money, so not sure that's viable here.

Marquise Brown or Darnell Mooney would probably be a little lower on salary (maybe not by much) and would probably fit what they're looking for in KC.

Yes, they need to develop their own, but I don't think you can just throw a draft pick at it and pray for the best again. We already know that a draft pick is probably going to take half the season to get acclimated (or more), do we really want to go into week 1 2024 with a nearly identical group to what KC has now?

I think the best course of action is to spend a 1st/2nd on WR and then grab a halfway decent one in FA (Mooney, Brown, or maybe Ridley). Add those to Rice and Kelce and I think you already have made a significant improvement on the 2023 group. If either Toney or Moore finally amounts to anything at all then it's just icing on the cake, but I wouldn't count on it with either.

MVS will be gone next year and Watson will likely still be around because of his salary, but if we start 2024 with Justin Watson getting starting reps again then something went terribly wrong.

They've decided to pay the OL. Everyone hoping next years WR group is drastically different than this years is gonna be in for some rude awakenings.

They need the cheap labor from draft picks to work out. So yeah, keep drafting them.

I'd love to trade our first and a pick next year to the 9ers for Aiyuk or make a big swing. But I'm guessing they continue to build this way as the QB continues to get expensive.

Doesn't mean they'll continue that trend of paying the OL. Thuney and Taylor are likely both here through 2025. Thuney won't (and shouldn't) remain beyond 2025, Taylor can be cut after that year with minimal dead money. Not sure they pay both Smith and Creed, likely pay one of them and will backload the contract like they usually do. Yes there is a lot of investment at OL but not prohibitively so that they can't make other moves, particularly if they move on from Chris Jones.

I can see Darnell Mooney going for maybe $17 million a year tops. If we can pay $12 million a year to MVS they can probably manage to pay a little more for a better player.

Depending on how the rest of the year goes I just don't see how KC, and Mahomes in particular, are happy going into 2024 with mostly the same group. If Moore or Toney somehow steps up a bit in the 2nd half of the year then maybe they don't have to have a wholesale overhaul, but if we continue to see Rice as the only consistent option at WR it's putting a lot of eggs in one (rookie) basket to hope that we get another hit at WR where our track record has been extremely bad at finding talent in the draft.

I just don't see paying a mid tier WR 20ish million dollars as the way forward. I'd look around at older guys who wanna come on for a ring chasing type thing before I'd do that.

They've gotta draft their stars. Point blank.

It's too expensive to go elsewhere to do it at this point.

If the Chargers cut Keenan Allen, I'd sign him in a heartbeat though.

A shitload.

That's what happens when you draft well and develop guys.

Gonna have to keep doing it.

I don't think Mooney will break the bank as a FA WR. He's the guy I want the most. Then draft your other outside guy.

A straight-line speed guy like Quez Watkins or throwing a dart at Van Jefferson might not be bad either as a #4/5 type if they are cheap.

The mid tier WR pay hasn't necessarily equalized yet, but man I dunno if that's really a level we wanna get. The last few years those guys just haven't valued out at much.

Hollywood will probably hit the market and end up making.....19 million a year. I dunno.

I like Mooney as a value option FA stab and don't expect them to spend big on a WR in FA. I'm not opposed to bringing back Hardman on a value deal, either. It's going to be available.

In the draft, let's juice it up. Give me a deep threat. Juicy deep speed that can threaten teams down the field.

I kind of like Adonai Mitchell as a guy whose college career has depressed his numbers. I could see him really out-performing his draft slot. I'm not very interested in Legette. I see a lot more Treylon Burks than A.J. Brown there.

I'll also say Ladd McConkey interests me a bit. I'm not sure how well he would separate against sticky man coverage, but he seems fast and shifty and smart, and he displays good hands most of the time. The only excpetion being a funk he hit earlier this year.

Leggette not doing ****-all his whole college career until year 5 is a huge red flag to me.

McConkey-I think I saw a 4.6 forty time for him? Wha?

I'm kind of on the Worthy train as a guy that a)might be in reach and b)has elite, hot, nasty speed. Gimme some of dat. Even if it's just to run go routes.

Don't try to tell anybody here that. You'll get voted off the island.

Expensive free agents are the answer.

I see the connection to Mooney, like him just fine, he'd be our current #1, but am not overly impressed and would definitely not pay him the quoted $17m.

Regarding more budget friendly WR FAs, how about Gabriel Davis, Rashid Shaheed, or Josh Reynolds?

Is Worthy more Tyreek or Mecole, though?

I'd probably pay Mooney, if we're ditching MVS and his $10m.

and I'd still be drafting a WR in the first two rounds.

Because we really need to grow our own.

I don't know. Nobody does.